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  #21  
Old February 16th, 2008, 12:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Supplement Four View Post
Ever tried Classic Traveller?
I used to play CT in the Mid 80's but stopped playing due to lack of finding other players

I did not think CT was complex but other people I tried to get to play the game had that impression even after playing a game or two.
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  #22  
Old February 16th, 2008, 12:28 AM
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Originally Posted by tbeard1999 View Post
I liked the starship design system. But robject pointed out that most of the things I liked were rules written by MWM. After seeing a draft of MWM's rules, I do think that MGT did a good job of streamlining them.

The character generation system is okay, although the survival rolls are way too high for military careers.

I've not tackled the world generation and animal/encounter stuff yet. EDG's stuff looks interesting, but it doesn't look like it's gonna get implemented in MGT.



And that is the cryin' shame of it all. There's nothing inherently complex about Traveller. Classic Traveller is especially easy to play and run, though it needs a better "to hit" and armor/damage mechanics. As well as a tech update and more weapons. Ironically, most of those pieces are already out there, just waiting to be picked up.

The MGT character generation system, the MGT starship design system, a variant of High Guard combat system that doesn't require moving counters on a board (or miniatures on a table), and the T4 armor/damage system could easily replace comparable CT subsystems and the result would be a simple, elegant and fun game.

I don't care at all for the d20 system, so I don't play T20. But I did appreciate the obvious affection for Traveller shown by its designers. Mongoose should have looked at T20 as an example of how to do a Traveller remake right.



IMHO, MGT will confirm the stereotype of Traveller as an unplayable, absurdly fussy mess, suitable only for long time Traveller fans. Of course the bitter irony is that some of the most vocal critics of MGT are "long time Traveller fans".



Yep. And MGT will do nothing to change that belief.



Given that their core task and combat systems are far more fiddly and involved than most previous Traveller systems, I can't believe that this was actually a design goal (no matter what they claim). I can't see how any reasonable person could look at the combat system (and the defective starship combat system) and see a simplified version of Traveller.
I was hoping for a version the Traveller that would appeal to more gamers, so at least in part it would be easier for me to find a traveler game to play in. It’s kind of sad that I can find more people to play Wizards of the Cost Star War (which I will never play) than Traveller.[/QUOTE]

Well, you might try T20. If it's too complex, strip it down to look more like Star Wars.

Unless of course, you don't want to run a d20 game.

Fear not though. When the new version of Chaosium's "Basic Roleplaying" comes out, I'll probably do an unofficial Traveller variant. That system is very simple and elegant (and I'd respect that in any variant I did).

In the meantime, try running Classic Traveller with the damage and armor rules from T4 and Book 2 and Supplement 4 characters only. If you want a more modern character generation system, I produced one that would let you design your character. It's working well in my current Traveller campaign.

My thoughts on converting T4 combat system to CT: http://www.travellerrpg.com/CotI/Dis...ad.php?t=14974

My alternate CT character generation system:
http://www.travellerrpg.com/CotI/Dis...ad.php?t=14819

YMMV of course.

Oh, to make CT weapons sexier, give them twice as much ammunition at TL 9+ and tell the players they fire caseless rounds. Also, sex up the weapon names. It's not a Rifle, it's a Heavy Pulse Rifle. It's not a Carbine, it's a Light Pulse Rifle or an Assault Carbine. Almost any weapon can be sexed up by adding "Assault", "Combat", "Battle", "Heavy", "Tactical", "Medium", "Light", etc. to its name. It isn't a revolver, its a Heavy Assault Revolver.[/QUOTE]



Some good points in here. At this point I would play any version of Traveller if I could only find a in person Traveller game in my area.

But to date my favorite Traveller versions are: CT and of course T20.
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  #23  
Old February 16th, 2008, 05:06 AM
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Who is the greater nuisance?

Someone who picks on many different aspects of a game, backed up with arguments, or someone who picks on the picker with the same argument everytime?

EDIT: That is to say: What Hunter said. If someone doesn´t like tbeard´s points, he doesn´t have to read his threads. But if you enter a thread, don´t complain about it´s existance.

EDITEDIT: ObTrav
Why isn´t every military in Known Space training their officers solely in Tactics? THat would mean the troops would march faster, shoot more often and better and make more damage. Every two second increment of a campaign.

Last edited by Able Baker; February 16th, 2008 at 05:09 AM..
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  #24  
Old February 16th, 2008, 11:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hunter View Post
If you think there are too many negative MGT posts, start positive ones of your own.
Do you really think fans of the game want to post here, in the current climate? 15 out of 21 threads, all by the same openly hostile poster about the same complaint - speaks for itself.
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  #25  
Old February 16th, 2008, 12:18 PM
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Do you really think fans of the game want to post here, in the current climate? 15 out of 21 threads, all by the same openly hostile poster about the same complaint - speaks for itself.
I concur.
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  #26  
Old February 16th, 2008, 12:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Able Baker View Post
EDITEDIT: ObTrav
Why isn´t every military in Known Space training their officers solely in Tactics? THat would mean the troops would march faster, shoot more often and better and make more damage. Every two second increment of a campaign.
This is a good point. I predict this will be one of the "hidden" problems with MGT that gamers will pick up on only after playing the game a while.

The GM will see a problem, and then he'll house-rule it. Mature gamers will go with what the GM says. The other gamers (who have characters with high Tactics skill) will bitch that the game is "not as fun" after the change.

This is prime example of what I mean when I say MGT seems like a GM's not-well-thought-out house rules rather than something a professional game designer should put out.
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  #27  
Old February 16th, 2008, 12:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Echo View Post
Do you really think fans of the game want to post here, in the current climate? 15 out of 21 threads, all by the same openly hostile poster about the same complaint - speaks for itself.
Why not? I post over at the MGT forum, and it's overwhelmingly "pro MGT" over there.

It doesn't stop me from posting when I have something to say.

And, TBeard was posting over there until...(slaps head)...Oh yeah. THEY BANNED HIM. Remember?
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  #28  
Old February 16th, 2008, 02:13 PM
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I think the inference that tbeard1999 was somehow an innocent party, banned for no good reason from those forums, just goes to show how far removed this forum is, currently.

And no, I don't think that is a healthy thing at all.
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  #29  
Old February 16th, 2008, 03:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Supplement Four View Post
Why not? I post over at the MGT forum, and it's overwhelmingly "pro MGT" over there.

It doesn't stop me from posting when I have something to say.

And, TBeard was posting over there until...(slaps head)...Oh yeah. THEY BANNED HIM. Remember?
For making personal attacks on the designer.

End of this direction of talk, please.
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Smith & Wesson: The Original Point and Click interface!

Archduke of Sylea (CORE 2118)
Duke of the Third Imperium (SPIN 0534)
Count Terra (SOLO 1827)
Count Gorod (REFT 1302)
Count of the Third Imperium (SPIN 2232)
Viscount of Adabicci (SPIN 1824)
Marquis of the Solomani Rim (SOLO 0606)
Marquis of the Third Imperium (SPIN 2410)
Baron of the Third Imperium (SPIN 2231)
Knight of the Iridium Throne (CORE 1434)
Sir William Hostman (OLDE 0512)
Sir William Hostman (DAGU 0622)
Knight of Deneb (REFT 2239)
Knight of Deneb (Spin 2532)
SEH w/Diamonds for Extreme Heroism - Battle of Boughene
MCG - Battle of Boughene
TAS: William Hostman (CORR 2506)
TAS: Bearer (DAIB 1326)
IMTU ct+ tm++ tne tg-- tt+ tmo+ t4- t20+ to ru+ ge+ 3i+ c+ jt au ls pi+ ta he+ st+
Wil Hostman 0602 C539857-9 S A724
OTU: 95% 3i an+ au+ br- cpu dt f+ fs++ ge ih- inf j jf+ jm+ jt+ ls- n= nc+ pi+ pp-- tp+ tr+ tv- vi-- xb+-
Unless there is bold red text, presume my posts to be my personal material only.
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  #30  
Old February 16th, 2008, 03:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tbeard1999 View Post
Oh, to make CT weapons sexier, give them twice as much ammunition at TL 9+ and tell the players they fire caseless rounds. Also, sex up the weapon names. It's not a Rifle, it's a Heavy Pulse Rifle. It's not a Carbine, it's a Light Pulse Rifle or an Assault Carbine. Almost any weapon can be sexed up by adding "Assault", "Combat", "Battle", "Heavy", "Tactical", "Medium", "Light", etc. to its name. It isn't a revolver, its a Heavy Assault Revolver.


I like it.
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