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  #1  
Old September 8th, 2014, 04:21 AM
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Default D&D 5E/Next

I'm running D&D 5E for my FLGS. (My "home" game at the moment is FFG Star Wars.)

I'm liking much of it. It is, at first level, a bit more "epic" than prior editions. I've run OE, Moldvay, Mentzer, Alston/Denning, AD&D 1E (w/ & w/o UA), AD&D 2E, 3.0, 4.0; I've played in a one-shot of 3.5. I've not done holmes, OE+supplements. I've only done one session of 2E + PO:S&P... ugh, what a nightmare...

So, two sessions down on 5E... and I'm finding it to be remarkably well put together.

There are a LOT of special cases - but if you can trust your players to follow them, the core is REALLY straightforward.

1st level characters are tougher & buffer than the older editions, but not so buff as the 4E ones.

One core mechanic:
All rolls are 1d20 + Attribute Modifier + Proficiency Bonus.
The attribute modifier is the same as in 3.x.
The proficiency bonus is based upon Character Level... you only add it if you're proficient in whatever. essentially, it's 1+(Level/4), round up. Even if you have multiple things that would apply, you only add it once.

If you have advantages to the roll, but no disadvantages, roll 2d20, keeping the better die.
If you have disadvantages to the roll, but no advantages, roll 2d20, keeping the worse die.
If you have both or neither, just roll the 1d20.
You can be proficient in the 6 Saving Throws, in the 18 different skills, in any of over a dozen specified tool-sets, in specific weapons and armors.

Most characters are proficient in saves for two attributes. Most have 3-5 proficient skills and/or tools.

Several races have additional racial specialties that grant proficiency on narrow areas.

All save targets work out to be 8+AttMod+ProficiencyBonus, basing upon the attribute and proficiency bonus of the caster, with their type of magic determining which attribute they use. So Dimmy Dimwit, Int 3 level 1 wizard, his spells have a save TN of 6... 8 base, -4 for int 3, +2 for proficiency. (Yes, this would be legal - class attribute minimums only apply for multi-class characters. And are always 13's. A guy with flat 13's can multiclass into everything. But you can have your Int 3 wizard, or your Str 3 fighter again.) And Wilfred Wiseman, Wis 20, Level 18 cleric is throwing DC 19 at his victims as a save target (8+5+6).

A few abilities double the proficiency bonus for certain uses. Rogues get a couple skills doubled.

It's fast, it's easy. Oh, and it is brutal. In two sessions, one 7P, one 5P, but no clerics in party, 2 wizards, a fighter, and a rogue dropped to 0 HP. The fighter died. (It's Adventurer's League play, and he's under Level 4, so he gets a resurrection for losing a session of XP. And he lost out on over 100 XP that session.) Death saves are UGLY. No attribute applies. 10+ on 1d20 (55% chance); succeed 3x and you stabilize; fail 3 times, you die. Roll once per round. Anyone else can stabilize you with a Wisdom DC 10 check action.

It's missing ONE very useful rule from prior editions... namely, Running.
See, Joe Normal can, without penalties, jog along at a steady pace that's impressive: 6.8 MPH. And with the optional feat rules, the right feat makes it 9.1 MPH. A Wood Elf Monk of 18th level with that feat can hit 17 MPH... and 14.8 MPH without it.bloody impressive for a marathon... (Which the official record works out to be about 12.85 MPH)

But it does work reasonably well. Normal human walking pace unencumbered is 3.4 MPH, and that's just a bit faster than the late teens to mid 20's normal pace of 3.1-3.3 MPH.

I got through a LOT. The game allows for, but doesn't actually encourage, use of minis. It pretty much ignores facing. It plays fast and loose.

I'm enjoying the hell out of it. On the down side, 4 characters out of HP? That's brutal.

Oh, and they upped the hit die types for several classes:
Barbarians: d12
Fighters, Rangers, Paladins: d10
Wizards, Sorcerers: d6
Everyone else: d8

And, at first level, you're maxed. In League play, you get average roll, rounded up, for levels after first.

I got to thinking... a revised T20 using the 5E mechanic could be a lot of fun. Be VERY different in feel....

I
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Old September 8th, 2014, 02:21 PM
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You have missed one very important new addition - the personality traits and backgrounds which are very Cortex/FATE like.

I've run quite a few session of it now (party is the classic fighter, magic user, cleric and thief) and it has been great fun.

The advantage/disadvantage is hands down the best innovation in the game - and I'm tempted to hack it into my Traveller rules (along with the personality traits and backgrounds)
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Old September 8th, 2014, 04:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike wightman View Post
You have missed one very important new addition - the personality traits and backgrounds which are very Cortex/FATE like.
They don't have FATE-like nor Cortex-Like strong mechanical impacts. They merely grant inspiration.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike wightman View Post
The advantage/disadvantage is hands down the best innovation in the game - and I'm tempted to hack it into my Traveller rules (along with the personality traits and backgrounds)
I agree it is, but it's a little more cumbersome with 2d6.
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Old September 8th, 2014, 05:16 PM
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And inspiration allows you to gain advantage on any roll...

play your character traits, even the negative ones, and get a bonus - very cortex/FATE like
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Old September 8th, 2014, 06:42 PM
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From what I've seen of it, it looks good. I recognize a lot of the changes made to 3.x in Mongoose's Conan RPG, now in D&D Next. Since I think the Conan RPG is the best version of 3.x that I've seen, that's a high compliment for D&D 5.

If I were to play D&D again, I'd certainly give D&D 5 a try. It looks like a good system to me.
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Old September 9th, 2014, 06:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aramis View Post
I agree it is, but it's a little more cumbersome with 2d6.
If you have advantage, roll 3d6, discard the lowest die. If you have disadvantage, roll 3d6, discard the highest die.

Would the math of this work in CT/MGT?
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Old September 9th, 2014, 05:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Golan2072 View Post
If you have advantage, roll 3d6, discard the lowest die. If you have disadvantage, roll 3d6, discard the highest die.

Would the math of this work in CT/MGT?
Depends upon your definition of "work"...


3d6k22d62d20k11d20
Mean8.45833333333333713.82510.5
Median97201
Mode971510.5
StdDev2.220019903535332.420839754357794.71699056602835.77350269189626

a 2 point shift on an 11 point range, or a roughly 4 point shift on a 20 point range.


Left side is 2d6 normal (amber), 3d6k2L disadvantage (red) and 3d6K2H advantage (green).
Right side is 1d20 normal (amber) 2d20K1L disadvantage (red), 2d20K1H advantage (green).

Because of the way the shifting works, it really doesn't work for me on the 2d6 curve to use 3d6.
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File Type: gif 3d6vs2d20.gif (7.4 KB, 149 views)
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Last edited by aramis; September 9th, 2014 at 07:45 PM..
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Old September 9th, 2014, 08:01 PM
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Had another idea...
rather than using 2d6/3d6k2... why not just use 3d12 all the time. Advantage, keep high, disad, keep low, normal, keep middle?

It rounds the bell a bit at the top... but really keeps the nice slant.

And it cures the most annoying thing for me about adjusting dice... I want to be able to roll the same pool all the time, as it speeds up play. (I put up with variable numbers of dice in FFG star wars because the result methodology is so nifty.)
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File Type: gif 3d12.gif (6.9 KB, 2 views)
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Archduke of Sylea (CORE 2118)
Duke of the Third Imperium (SPIN 0534)
Count Terra (SOLO 1827)
Count Gorod (REFT 1302)
Count of the Third Imperium (SPIN 2232)
Viscount of Adabicci (SPIN 1824)
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SEH w/Diamonds for Extreme Heroism - Battle of Boughene
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IMTU ct+ tm++ tne tg-- tt+ tmo+ t4- t20+ to ru+ ge+ 3i+ c+ jt au ls pi+ ta he+ st+
Wil Hostman 0602 C539857-9 S A724
OTU: 95% 3i an+ au+ br- cpu± dt± f+ fs++ ge± ih- inf± j± jf+ jm+ jt+ ls- n= nc+ pi+ pp-- tp+ tr+ tv- vi-- xb+-
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  #9  
Old October 3rd, 2014, 04:02 AM
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Well... Y'know how in d20, people complained about the imbalance of having a 1st level in a 3rd level party? Doesn't seem to be there in 5E. My table had 3 3rds and 1 1st level tonight.

Ran smooth, and the 1st level contributed quite adequately.
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Count Terra (SOLO 1827)
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SEH w/Diamonds for Extreme Heroism - Battle of Boughene
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IMTU ct+ tm++ tne tg-- tt+ tmo+ t4- t20+ to ru+ ge+ 3i+ c+ jt au ls pi+ ta he+ st+
Wil Hostman 0602 C539857-9 S A724
OTU: 95% 3i an+ au+ br- cpu± dt± f+ fs++ ge± ih- inf± j± jf+ jm+ jt+ ls- n= nc+ pi+ pp-- tp+ tr+ tv- vi-- xb+-
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Old October 3rd, 2014, 11:46 AM
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5E D&D. I had to eat a lot of crow on this one. Like Aramis, I too have played every incarnation of D&D that has existed, and like Aramis, found that there has been a lot to be desired in the "original" RPG in all its various incarnations. But that has never stopped me from playing it.

Well, that was true until the fiasco that was 4E, where I convinced convinced that WOC couldn't touch a non-card/board game without destroying it. D&D was dead. For once, I am glad that I was wrong.

5E is a very slick system. Its mechanics are easy to use and speed up play considerably compared to prior editions. You can run higher level characters with lower level characters and not have the lower level characters feel that they are not contributing, and those same "lower level" monsters that you used running 1st to 3rd level adventures can still be used to challenge higher level characters, all without loosing the feel that you are running a higher level of play. One downside that the game has is that it lacks some of the flexibility in character creation that a few of the prior editions had coming out the gate, but it has an amazing amount of potential for future products and tons of advice for expanding things yourself.

5E overall is an amazing system, and in my humble opinion, the best version of D&D to be produced in over 20 years. I highly recomend taking a look at it if your a D&D fan.

Oh, and Aramis how about using some variation of the New Era Mechanic, of attribute plus skill level, roll under on a d20? If the roll low mechanic is no good, then use skill level plus stat mod. I think advantage/disadvantage would work fantastically with it, and you could still take damage out of attributes without having to resort to hit points or whatever.

Cryton
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