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Imperial Interstellar Scout Service Details of the worlds of the Imperium (and beyond).

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Old July 27th, 2016, 04:27 PM
Spartan159 Spartan159 is offline
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Default Tidal lock

If a planet in the habitable zone of an M class star had a decent sized moon, would that possibly keep the main world from being tidal locked to the star?

I'm looking at both Rhylanor and Porozlo in particular. "Thwacks Grandfather upside the head with a trout" I may just declare Ancients! IMTU for supposedly temperate worlds around M stars in the Spinward Marches.
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Old July 27th, 2016, 06:02 PM
tjoneslo tjoneslo is offline
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As I understand it, that moon would either be smashed into the planet or ejected from the whole system. The same tidal forces that stop the planet from rotating would also mangle the moon.
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Old July 27th, 2016, 07:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spartan159 View Post
If a planet in the habitable zone of an M class star had a decent sized moon, would that possibly keep the main world from being tidal locked to the star?

I'm looking at both Rhylanor and Porozlo in particular. "Thwacks Grandfather upside the head with a trout" I may just declare Ancients! IMTU for supposedly temperate worlds around M stars in the Spinward Marches.
Several theorize that such a pair could last long enough to be life-bearing.
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Old July 27th, 2016, 08:45 PM
Lycanorukke Lycanorukke is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spartan159 View Post
If a planet in the habitable zone of an M class star had a decent sized moon, would that possibly keep the main world from being tidal locked to the star?

I'm looking at both Rhylanor and Porozlo in particular. "Thwacks Grandfather upside the head with a trout" I may just declare Ancients! IMTU for supposedly temperate worlds around M stars in the Spinward Marches.
A few ways to dodge tidal locking apart from a moon.

Resonant spin/orbit - ie: Mercury where a day is 59 Earth days.

Big Impact - something hit the planet a few million years ago spinning it up. It will lock again in another million years, but for now you have day/night.

Recent arrival - The planet migrated in from the outer system or is a captured rogue. Again it will lock eventually but for now you're sweet.

Atmosphere - A very interesting one. A paper discusses how an atmosphere can counteract tidal locking in some circumstances. Brief overview here.
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Old July 28th, 2016, 10:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Spartan159 View Post
I'm looking at both Rhylanor and Porozlo in particular. "Thwacks Grandfather upside the head with a trout" I may just declare Ancients! IMTU for supposedly temperate worlds around M stars in the Spinward Marches.
GT: First In has a world-design example of Rhylanor scattered among the sidebars thru the book. It suggests that Rhylanor is currently in an orbital configuration in which it completes exactly 5 retrograde rotations on its axis per prograde revolution about its primary star.
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Old July 28th, 2016, 04:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lycanorukke View Post
A few ways to dodge tidal locking apart from a moon.

Resonant spin/orbit - ie: Mercury where a day is 59 Earth days.

Big Impact - something hit the planet a few million years ago spinning it up. It will lock again in another million years, but for now you have day/night.

Recent arrival - The planet migrated in from the outer system or is a captured rogue. Again it will lock eventually but for now you're sweet.

Atmosphere - A very interesting one. A paper discusses how an atmosphere can counteract tidal locking in some circumstances. Brief overview here.
Another scenario that I've given some thought to is ice accumulation on the night side causing enough imbalance that libration would eventually "tip the scales" and slowly flip the planet back around into a new lock position. It would mean lock-freeze-thaw-flood cycles lasting a several million years. During that interval continents (if any) could drift into the daylight or into the night.

It's just conjecture; I haven't actually worked it out. It would have to be a huge amount of ice, possible 5 points of the hydro digit.
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Old July 28th, 2016, 04:41 PM
shaunhilburn shaunhilburn is offline
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Originally Posted by Spartan159 View Post
"Thwacks Grandfather upside the head with a trout" I may just declare Ancients! IMTU for supposedly temperate worlds around M stars in the Spinward Marches.
The notion of flare sterilized M dwarf planets with a frozen atmosphere on the outer hemisphere started to fall into disfavor about 15 years ago.

The possibility of temperate, even hospitable M dwarf worlds is now taken seriously enough that funding is allocated to searching for them.
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Old July 28th, 2016, 07:45 PM
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Originally Posted by whulorigan View Post
GT: First In has a world-design example of Rhylanor scattered among the sidebars thru the book. It suggests that Rhylanor is currently in an orbital configuration in which it completes exactly 5 retrograde rotations on its axis per prograde revolution about its primary star.
If that is the case, then how does the daylight side keep from frying, and the nighttime side keep from freezing?
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Old July 28th, 2016, 09:04 PM
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Originally Posted by timerover51 View Post
If that is the case, then how does the daylight side keep from frying, and the nighttime side keep from freezing?
Rhylanor has a 3 atmosphere (Very thin). So who's to say it hasn't already.

The general rule for these kind of worlds is if the atmosphere is thick enough it doesn't have time to freeze out. The slow rotation of the world with it's constant (if slow) shifting of the face toward the world
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Old July 28th, 2016, 10:50 PM
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Rhylanor has a 3 atmosphere (Very thin). So who's to say it hasn't already.

The general rule for these kind of worlds is if the atmosphere is thick enough it doesn't have time to freeze out. The slow rotation of the world with it's constant (if slow) shifting of the face toward the world
Slow rotation, like Venus, would be worse than a tidal lock. With a tidal lock you have a habitable zone between the "day" and "night" side. With a slow rotation, you have a wait on death row for your day in the sun...
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