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Agent of the Imperium Discussion of Marc Miller's Novel, Agent of the Imperium.

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Old January 21st, 2017, 10:39 PM
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Default Deyis II Redux

I've started this thread to avoid committing one of my all-too-usual sins; crapping up another thread.

While trying to help the Imperial Cartographer(1) check AotI against the Traveller Map, I realized that the AotI version of Deyis II is profoundly different from the previous version found in canon.

Deyis II is appears a few times in MT. An aside in Knightfall mentions the planet as hosting an access portal to the Primordial City's pocket universe. In MT's Folio Adventure 2 Outpost Alpha, which was distributed as part of the Referee's Gaming Kit, the planet is described in far more detail.

In MT, Deyis has a 70 year orbit meaning it "enjoys" a 35 year long summer and winter. Naturally, both flora and fauna have evolved various strategies like hibernation, robust eggs/seed pods, and the like. During the Ziru Sirka, the Vilani visited the world during it's winter, decided it wasn't worth settling, and moved on. During the Rule of Man, the Solomani visited during it's summer, decided to give it a try, and founded a colony that mysteriously failed.

After that, the world was was never settled and rarely visited. There is very little of commercial value while the life cycles of the flora and fauna make their use and/or transplantation very difficult.

During the Rebellion era, a party from Dulinor's faction vists the world to refuel and tangles with a scouting party from Lucan's faction. Most importantly, the party contacts a previously unsuspected sophont species; the Kebkh. (It also turns out the Kebkh were responsible for the failed Solomani colony.)

In AotI, Deyis orbit isn't mentioned. In 501 the planetary population is 94 million, roughly half human and half Kebkh. While the system was brought into the Imperium during the Second Century IE, it was settled far in the past as a Karand palace dating from the Second Millenium, -8000 to -7000 IE, exists.

Not only are the Kebkh known in AotI, they're integrated into the Imperium and enough are living off Deyis when that world was scrubbed in 501 that some are living on Reference in 620.

I can't see how the MT and AotI stories can be reconciled.

Finally, in the other thread Robject mentions that Our Absent Friend Don took an interest in Deyis II and the Kebkh with an eye towards "cleaning up" DGP's Primordials/Baddies from the Core suggestion. (There was an implied connection between the Primordials and Kebkh. IIRC, Mr. Fugate touched on the topic in his Q&A column in a MTJ issue.)

The Deyis II story in AotI may be how the Primordials/Baddies are removed from canon, much like how one of Strephon's diary entries buried IRIS.

All this could be bunk, of course, as I'm just a gray headed old fat man with too much time on his hands.


1 - Hi Inexorabletash!
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Old January 22nd, 2017, 02:47 PM
maksimsmelchak maksimsmelchak is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whipsnade View Post
I can't see how the MT and AotI stories can be reconciled.
In typically GDW fashion, wield the retcon sledgehammer.

The Kebkh are now 5-peds according to AOTI.

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Originally Posted by Whipsnade View Post
Finally, in the other thread Robject mentions that Our Absent Friend Don took an interest in Deyis II and the Kebkh with an eye towards "cleaning up" DGP's Primordials/Baddies from the Core suggestion. (There was an implied connection between the Primordials and Kebkh. IIRC, Mr. Fugate touched on the topic in his Q&A column in a MTJ issue.)
*** What is the Core suggestion, please? ***

Shalom,
Maksim-Smelchak.
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Old January 22nd, 2017, 02:59 PM
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The primordials are an advanced race that pre-dates the Ancients by a considerable margin. Their juvenile form is the race on Deyis.

They long ago left this part of space to head to the galactic core.

Grandfather gave the Zhodani their precog machine to spur them to investigate where the primordials went off to.

During the MT/Rebellion era they (the primordials/sparklers) were going to come back. and cause all sort of mischief - to be detailed in the adventure that would have accompanied the Zhodani/Droyne alien book

MT Journal issue 4 tells you everything we know.
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Old January 22nd, 2017, 03:46 PM
maksimsmelchak maksimsmelchak is offline
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Thanks, Mike.

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Originally Posted by mike wightman View Post
The primordials are an advanced race that pre-dates the Ancients by a considerable margin. Their juvenile form is the race on Deyis.
Oy. So Kebkh = Primordial. Oy vey.

I got the impression that the Kebkh were furred mammals.

Marc made them 5-peds in AOTI.

So, now they later turn into reptilianoid snails... LOL

Traveller is always good for an interesting story. LOL

Quote:
Originally Posted by mike wightman View Post
They long ago left this part of space to head to the galactic core.
I remember that now. Thanks. And numerous subplots that the ancients and Primordials had a love/hate relationship.

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Originally Posted by mike wightman View Post
Grandfather gave the Zhodani their precog machine to spur them to investigate where the primordials went off to. During the MT/Rebellion era they (the primordials/sparklers) were going to come back. and cause all sort of mischief - to be detailed in the adventure that would have accompanied the Zhodani/Droyne alien book.
OK. Cool. I recall it now. Wish I had Whipsnade's memory for the minutia.

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Originally Posted by mike wightman View Post
MT Journal issue 4 tells you everything we know.
I haven't read that book for at least a decade... LOL

Shalom,
Maksim-Smelchak.
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Old January 22nd, 2017, 06:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maksimsmelchak View Post
Oy. So Kebkh = Primordial.

Not quite.

MT Kebkh = Primordial. AotI/T5 Kebkh = Something Else Entirely.

It's pretty clear that MT Deyis II =/= AotI/T5 Deyis II.

Quote:
Oy vey.
That's putting it mildly.

Quote:
I got the impression that the Kebkh were furred mammals.
They sort of were, but...

Quote:
Marc made them 5-peds in AOTI.
... they were changed and - most likely - deliberately so.

Quote:
So, now they later turn into reptilianoid snails.
The "videos" seen at the Shimmering City in Knightfall show the "adult" Primordials simply as larger versions of the "juvenile" form. The "adults" walk upright while the "juveniles" walk on all fours with the behavior of the "adults" is shown as less foolish and involve psionics.

The large furry sessile (?) nautilidae Mr. Fugate writes about in MTJ #4 seem to be a body form which either occurs later in the life cycle or (perhaps) one that is deliberately chosen.

Quote:
Wish I had Whipsnade's memory for the minutia.
I put on two different color socks this morning. Believe me, you don't want my memory.
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Old January 28th, 2017, 10:35 AM
maksimsmelchak maksimsmelchak is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whipsnade View Post
Not quite.
MT Kebkh = Primordial. AotI/T5 Kebkh = Something Else Entirely.

It's pretty clear that MT Deyis II =/= AotI/T5 Deyis II.

That's putting it mildly.

They sort of were, but...

... they were changed and - most likely - deliberately so.

The "videos" seen at the Shimmering City in Knightfall show the "adult" Primordials simply as larger versions of the "juvenile" form. The "adults" walk upright while the "juveniles" walk on all fours with the behavior of the "adults" is shown as less foolish and involve psionics.

The large furry sessile (?) nautilidae Mr. Fugate writes about in MTJ #4 seem to be a body form which either occurs later in the life cycle or (perhaps) one that is deliberately chosen.

I put on two different color socks this morning. Believe me, you don't want my memory.
Thank you, Whipsnade, for your thoughtful reply.

I realize that the Primordials are veritable bullseye of retconning.

Shabbat Shalom,
Maksim-Smelchak.
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