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Classic Traveller Discussion on the granddaddy of them all, Classic Traveller!

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  #1  
Old July 3rd, 2020, 05:22 PM
Carlobrand Carlobrand is offline
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Default Sunsidized liner problems

There are problems with the Signal GK deck plans for the subsidized liner. No great surprise, it's too big, but nobody really cares a lot about that, they just want to know where they are on the ship. The real headache I'm having is the launch. It's described as slung under the cargo deck, which is below the crew deck. Up on the plans for the crew-passenger deck, there is the elevator to the launch, in the neck connecting the disc to the main body of the ship. Down below is the launch dock, with the same elevator. In between is - nothing. Elevator doesn't show as going through the cargo deck, which makes sense because it actually runs down forward of the cargo deck ...

... right in front of the cargo bay doors. Am I reading that right? Has there been any correction posted on the issue? I could put it on top instead of below, but that eliminates the bridge dome.

Oh, and where's the fuel. About a third of that ship is fuel. There are hints of fuel to the flanks of the cargo deck, but not a-third-of-the-ship worth. Is there an unstated fuel deck beneath the cargo deck?
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Old July 3rd, 2020, 07:25 PM
AnotherDilbert AnotherDilbert is offline
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That is a quite confused deck plan...

Yes, you are correct, there is no reasonable access to the cargo hold, and not even remotely enough fuel.

There might be small cargo hatches forward, to the left and right of the Launch Dock hump, angled downward?

Reasonably cargo should be loaded and unloaded via the small craft dock, so perhaps a hatch in the deck of the Forward Hold leading down into a corresponding hatch in the top of the small craft might solve the problem?


I get it to be:





Note that, according to the illustration on p18, there is a hump aft, below the cargo deck, that might contain more fuel. We can also squeeze in some fuel below the saucer.
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Old July 3rd, 2020, 08:42 PM
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The FASA version places the lower cargo hold aft, with the Launch parked in front of it. The paired lifts are supposed to meet the passenger access of the launch, and the Launch has a roof door that mates with the forward cargo lift.
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Old July 9th, 2020, 11:42 AM
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I don't think a hump aft would have the volume needed, though it'd be a good start. Assignment Vigilante seems to be hinting at a fuel deck below the cargo deck, if I read the bow/stern view of the graphic right. That would also explain the absence of a visible launch in that graphic, since the launch bay would then be within the fuel deck, essentially surrounded by fuel tankage. Those angles running from the hull bottom and top to the flanking passenger decks could also be fuel space; my math suggests the combination should be about right depending on the height of the fuel deck.

I see two solutions to the obstruction problem. There's an accessway to the launch running to starboard and a bit aft of the cargo deck doors (which I'd have put another block outward to keep that passage open). One solution is to move the elevator to a port position corresponding to the starboard accessway, so the launch bay accesses run to either side of the cargo doors.

The other is to reconfigure the bay slightly: widen that neck behind the cargo door and assume two forward cargo doors to port and starboard of the elevator and turret instead of one long cargo door. Turret's drawn as 3 meters wide - which seems a bit big to me - so a workable cargo door left-and-right of the turret would need a bit more space than is offered. Or, shrink the turret to 1.5 meter diameter, allowing two 3 meter cargo doors to either side of the turret/elevator. Strikes me as a bit prone to accidents, but they're loading in zero-g, which makes loading a lot more like docking and may mean they're using computers or bots for the loading process.

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Originally Posted by GypsyComet View Post
The FASA version places the lower cargo hold aft, with the Launch parked in front of it. The paired lifts are supposed to meet the passenger access of the launch, and the Launch has a roof door that mates with the forward cargo lift.
I'm having trouble visualizing this. Wouldn't the launch still obstruct the cargo doors? And, if the launch is forward of the cargo hold and mates with the cargo lift through a roof hatch, where is the forward cargo lift going?

Roof door wouldn't work for me - which is not to say it wouldn't work given the canon launch, but I did a variant on the standard cylindrical Supp-7 launch by throwing drives and fuel space into the otherwise unusable deadspace of the cylinder, top and bottom which would occur after running a 3-meter-square rectangle up the middle of the 4.5-meter-diameter cylinder for cargo/passengers/etc. That rectangle allowed the launch to accept a couple of standard 3m by 6m cargo containers (featured in the Subsidized Merchant deck plan), with shelves for smaller packages in the port/starboard curves and some passenger seats forward of the cargo containers. The dorsal and ventral curved bits coincidentally had just enough space for plant, drives, and tanks along the length of the craft. (I then modified the rear by adding a rear cargo door so it could accept the shipping containers while retaining the shelving port-and-starboard to get the most use of the available space. )

I get about 16 square meters to the 4.5 meter circle, 9 square meters, to the 3-meter square, so for every 13.5 cubic meter dTon of rectangular space there's 10.5 cubic meters or a bit over 3/4 dTon in the four curves. With drives and tanks in the top/bottom curves, that means 3 dTons to drive, plant, and tank, 3 dTons of small package space to left/right of the main cargo volume, 8 dTons for two shipping containers, 2 dTons for 4 seats, and the 4 dTon bridge in the nose cone (including air lock, fresher, and two crew seats).

(I considered throwing out the cylinder concept and making the whole thing a brick instead.)
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Old July 9th, 2020, 02:13 PM
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The simple solution is to, as suggested above, dock the launch in the middle of the stern, moving engineering to the sides.
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Old July 10th, 2020, 12:07 AM
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The FASA version has a larger pod at the rear, and the rear lift moves between the two cargo decks. The forward lift apparently doubles as the grapple for the Boat, as it lines up with the cargo area inside the Boat. Cargo in the boat is lifted directly into the upper cargo deck. Two personal lifts flank the nose of the Boat and allow personal transfer, as they line up with the airlock on the Boat.

And no, the Boat is not a standard layout in the FASA version.
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Old July 10th, 2020, 05:00 AM
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My solution is to have the boat dock on top of the ship rather than the bottom and ignore the text that says otherwise.
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Old July 10th, 2020, 10:54 PM
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I just built a completely new Type M. Streamlined, RORO. Looks like the Queen of Safari ships.
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Old July 12th, 2020, 04:32 PM
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I always thought there should be more solar powered spaceships.
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Old July 12th, 2020, 05:23 PM
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Still on the first page and someone feels the need to riff on the typo in the topic name...

-

Solar power is either that cheap thing you did before fusion or is some weird secret sauce, ala Star Wars Episode 2 (wherein something called a Solar Sailer is too fast to catch).

T5 codifies the Collectors first seen on the CT Annic Nova, and Mongoose has Solar systems that look Star Wars inspired (allows stealthy travel...as long as your opponents aren't looking for 6km wide mylar mirrors).
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