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2300AD & 2320 Discussion of the original 2300AD from GDW, the revised 2300 from Mongoose Publishing, or QLI's 2320AD.

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  #21  
Old April 15th, 2013, 01:58 PM
Kaye Kaye is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rgrove0172 View Post
Came across this while browsing, might be of interest in the current discussion.

http://www.aleph.se/Nada/Game/2300AD...onceptions.pdf

Specifically the part "Do all drives use Tantalum?"
This reminds one of the other ongoing discussion going on in the 'My 2320AD Universe'. The one about making ships available to PC's. When isomeres of similar metals are available, even with lower warp performance the payoff could be immense!

Niobium, Vanadium, Tungsten and perhaps others are not mentioned in the 'Stutterwarp misconceptions' article. And who knows: Perhaps Technetium can have purposes other than cancer treatment? But only for short range unmanned vehicles?
Hafnium is said to produce hard radiation when stimulated to perform a Jerome effect. That is not an issue for missiles. When all misiles can have their tantalum removed this frees up a lot of tantalum.
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  #22  
Old April 15th, 2013, 02:01 PM
BMonnery BMonnery is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaye View Post
Hafnium is said to produce hard radiation when stimulated to perform a Jerome effect. That is not an issue for missiles. When all misiles can have their tantalum removed this frees up a lot of tantalum.
but produces other issues, like missiles having to be stored disassembled. Pity the ship with an online Hafnium drive that crosses the shelf.....
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  #23  
Old April 15th, 2013, 06:31 PM
Peter Schutze Peter Schutze is offline
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"Not quite approaching the floor were stutterwarp ceases to work (0.15)"

Ive never heard this, only the gravity well effect on eficiency.

If its true then it would seem gravity wells should stop drives working at all with the steep drop off in efficiency
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  #24  
Old April 15th, 2013, 06:34 PM
Peter Schutze Peter Schutze is offline
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"Hafnium is said to produce hard radiation"

All of these (m) isotopes produce hard radiation when changing to the base state.
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  #25  
Old April 16th, 2013, 11:38 AM
BMonnery BMonnery is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Schutze View Post
"Not quite approaching the floor were stutterwarp ceases to work (0.15)"

Ive never heard this, only the gravity well effect on eficiency.

If its true then it would seem gravity wells should stop drives working at all with the steep drop off in efficiency
There being a lower floor is evidenced by the Bayern malfunction. How Bayern survived is amazing. One would guess some bright spark caught the error and ejected the coils causing the Bayern only to have a nearby nuclear explosion.

At 0.1 G the warp drive is insufficient to overcome the gravity well.

Engaging the drive within an atmosphere should causing immediate relaxation, and a kiloton "nuclear" explosion (rough conversion 1 kg Ta-180m = 10 tons TNT, orders of magnitude less than Pu-239, but there may be tons of the isomer). The Thorez or similar could be the ultimate terrorist weapon. Spin the drive up in the ground and 5 seconds later the city is engulfed in a nuclear fireball.

Something else to remember when discussing PC ships - every stutterwarp drive is a potential nuke.
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  #26  
Old April 18th, 2013, 07:52 AM
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I understand the mínimum Warp Efficiency, and that too much mass for the Warp Drive may destroy it, but I thought it would destroy the Drive, not provoking an overloading of the coils.

IMHO (I concede you're more knowledgeable about 2300 than myself) the coils charge is not mass dependent. Should it be, a loaded ship (most so for freighters, where loaded and unloaded mass diferes more) should have inferior range than the same ship unloaded.

My take is that having too much mass for the drive (WE under 0.1) would overload the drive, destroying it, not the coils, producing the nuclear explosión you talk about.

An, in any case, I guess after the Bayern accident, there would be some fuses to avoid this overloading, or some computer control about the mass to avoid it.
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  #27  
Old April 18th, 2013, 10:05 PM
Murph Murph is offline
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IM2300U, I use Gadolinium like H. Beam Piper did instead of Tantalum. I also have a much larger fleet and civilian space force size. Texas has 24 warships (2nd hand ex ESA destroyers and cruisers), with the French, British, US, Brazilians, etc having over 100 warships each.


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Originally Posted by epicenter00 View Post
There's actually a serious problem in 2300AD with the number of warships, and honestly the number of ships in general.

1) One is the infamous "Tantalum Question" thing in the game. Tantalum isn't that rare on Earth. I mean, it's rare but it's not that rare. So why are ships, let alone warships, so rare? Tantalum on Earth is so rare that people fight wars over it. The rarity is supposed to explain the lack of ships in the universe. But it's not that rare. I mean we make all kinds of stuff using Tantalum today. If it was that rare, would they make detonation missiles from it? Colin in MgT2300 tries to explain it that it's an isotope of Tantalum, but it still doesn't quite make much sense. I think there should be more ships or there has to be some other hold-up that keeps ships from being really common.

2) Another "laugh out loud" bad breaking of canon is in the Invasion sourcebook itself. There's all kinds of hints that BMonnery's fleet strengths are generally considered accurate as printed. So you have like Japan with like six ships or something total in their space fleet. Then you have Kimanjano with the French Foreign Legion with 50 fighters there.

Say what? 50?!

Yes, 50 fighters. The Star Cruiser scenario suggests they're Martels. These things are like armor 10 (yes 10) monsters. 50 of those monsters could probably fend off the Kafers by themselves, no matter how many ships the Kafers send. But more seriously, even if that's the entirety of the Foreign Legion's fighter strength (it somehow seems unlikely) ... 50 fighters in 2300 could pretty much take the fleets of any other power listed in the game without even calling in the rest of the French fleet.

To me, that the French can just base 50 Martels in Kimanjano suggests that even if the French the biggest power in 2300, the other powers have to have pretty large fleets, especially the Manchus.




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  #28  
Old April 20th, 2013, 04:03 AM
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Originally Posted by BMonnery View Post
but produces other issues, like missiles having to be stored disassembled. Pity the ship with an online Hafnium drive that crosses the shelf.....
Weird and wonderful things will happen to you in a very short time!

However, the drive coils have to be stored disasembled and be assembled just before being launched. This doesn't have to be an issue and the procedure can be automated and performed fairly quickly.
The missiles will be built to allow quick and automated assembly.
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  #29  
Old April 20th, 2013, 02:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BMonnery View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaye View Post
Hafnium is said to produce hard radiation when stimulated to perform a Jerome effect.
but produces other issues, like missiles having to be stored disassembled. Pity the ship with an online Hafnium drive that crosses the shelf.....
If hafnium produces this hard radiation only when stimulated to perform a Jerome effect, then those missiles could be carried assembled, as while their own stutterwarp drives are off line the coils don't accumulate charge (this is the base for the whole tugs use to reach distances over 7.7 LY).

The main problem then would be about recovering undetonated missiles, as they should have such charges...
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  #30  
Old April 20th, 2013, 04:16 PM
BMonnery BMonnery is offline
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Originally Posted by McPerth View Post
If hafnium produces this hard radiation only when stimulated to perform a Jerome effect, then those missiles could be carried assembled, as while their own stutterwarp drives are off line the coils don't accumulate charge (this is the base for the whole tugs use to reach distances over 7.7 LY).

The main problem then would be about recovering undetonated missiles, as they should have such charges...
Assembled but "inactive" drives apparently still accumulate charge. This is the risk of tugs take. The new drive must be assembled and brought online. The task is difficult (11+ on d10) with drive engineering as the skill, a typically skilled engineer will fail 80% of the time.

The ask is hazardous, so 3d6 on the failure table.

3-10 = retry (with determination check if 6-10, but this is probably unnecessary)
11-14 = mishap (2d6 on table below)
15+ = serious mishap (3d6 on table below)

Mishaps:

3-6 = superficial damage (drive is still okay and task can be attempted again, repair parts cost 1-10% of drive cost),
7-11 = minor mishap (drive is damaged, but no casualties, 5-50% of drive cost to repair),
12-15 = major mishap (drive seriously damaged, EP=1 explosion applied against engineers, 10-100% cost of repair),
16-18= total mishap (drive destroyed, EP=3 explosion applied against engineers, cost of repair 20%+, but 60% of the time nothing is salvagable).

The "normal" result of attempting to bring a drive online is a minor mishap. Tugships aren't viable because of the difficulty of getting the drive powered up.

Taking an active drive down is worse (15+ on d10), and has worse consequences.

A skill 3 engineer (CQ+2, typical well trained engineer) succeeds 30% of the time, gets a second chance 35% of the time, 12% of the time superficial damage occurs (try again, but long term repair costs), the remaining 23% of the time the drive is damaged beyond local repair and is no longer operable.

Bear this in mind, you break the drive about not quite half the time you try and bring it online.

Tugships are not truly viable for this reason.

The same applies to missiles. About one time in twenty the missile drive will explode, which is...... problematic.
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