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Ship's Locker Submit your favorite original equipment and weapons for others to use in their own Traveller campaigns.

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  #21  
Old July 26th, 2012, 04:25 AM
sabredog sabredog is offline
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Hence the ubiquitous snub pistol and always popular laser carbine or rifle.
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  #22  
Old July 26th, 2012, 04:30 AM
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Originally Posted by sabredog View Post
Hence the ubiquitous snub pistol and always popular laser carbine or rifle.
And perhaps more the reason for the big laser weapon backpacks. Not so much power for the beam but coolants to keep the thing from melting down in vacuum use. How hot would a weapon grade laser weapon get?
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  #23  
Old July 26th, 2012, 12:46 PM
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Slightly off topic but

Even long sustained fire, ie not firing as fast as you can, but continuely firing quickly over a long period of time can over heat a barrel too.

When I use to do .50 M2 training we would change out the barrels after 500 rounds (training recurits). These were already used barrels (ie their life expectancy was 50% or less) so they could not take as much fire heat as well taken care of barrels or new barrels.

Some times due to issues on the training firing line, M2 would go down (some times they were made to go down by the trainer who was tired of running recurits through their position and we had to keep going. Training dead lines and such.

During these times I and my other 2 Sgt buddies would do hot swaps on barrels. We would run (allow firing) of the M2 with a barrel until it started glowing or smoking, then swap it out for another. On one of our training days, a new Lt and his new armour Cpl, who did not know much, brought us the wrong barrels. They were already trashed (over heated and some even still had seperated casings still in the chamber.

But due to training schedules and such we could not wait until the correct barrels were brought up to the range so we had to start the live fire.

Some of these over heated (deadline) barrels only took 200+ round before they smoked, started to get a slight red color or even drooped some.

(not going into the long story of it but) one time we had to quickly finish up the training of the recurits so we lengthen the time between barrel changes (due to large numbers of individuals we had to fire. This was due to an order from the current Range Officer (Captain). When the barrel started to turn red, was only when we could change out barrels.

Well being short enough barrels per M2, as the day went on, we were having to place warm to hot barrels on the M2, ie they were not allowed enough cool down time.

By the end of the day (along with some politics between a Col and the Range Capt) M2 were starting to malfunction due to the amount of heat the main body was retaining now.

We got down to 2 functioning M2 and no cold barrels and 40 recurits still pump through in less than 1 hour.

Some of the barrels were getting so hot that at one point, my Cpl who was trying to take out a barrel, his abestes gloves started smoking.

About this time the other M2 went down because the bright Range Control Captain decided to order that water should be poured on the weapon and barrel to cool it down like they did in WW2. My senior Sgt (who was in charge of that M2) said NO. So the Captain order him off the weapon and told the Lt and armor to do it. They did and the the entire weapon was ruined (considered destroyed by Military standards).

That left my M2 with 10 recurits to go and 30 minutes to do it. I told the Cpl to get off the track (vehicle mounted M2) and make sure that each recurit wore a flank vest and riot shield visor (which we kept in our vehicles as part of our TO&E). I took the least hotest barrel & straightes barrel and mounted on. Each recurit had 100 rds of .50. By the 5 one the barrel was red, by the 6 or 7th (can remeber which) it was a runaway fire after the first shot, by the 8 individual the barrel was glowing and with the last 100 rds the barrel was turning white. Several of us swore that you could see the bullet traveling down the barrel on those last rounds.

With in 5 minutes or less of the last rounds fired though it, it was very clear that the barrel was drooping. If you fired a round through it you would have hit your own vehicle, if the round would go through it at all.

You see once a barrel has been heated too much, it loses it's needed temper and you just don't get those back. It's scrap.

(on a side note) when I got back to the motor pool, and was about to leave, the MSG of the pool came over and chewed us out. It turns out that the hot barrels we were placing on the vehicle to cool charred some of the paint and in one vehicle had cracked the case on a light housing.

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  #24  
Old July 26th, 2012, 03:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by far-trader View Post
And perhaps more the reason for the big laser weapon backpacks. Not so much power for the beam but coolants to keep the thing from melting down in vacuum use. How hot would a weapon grade laser weapon get?
Good point! Even when not in vacuum it might not be a bad idea to have some nitrogen to shoot down the barrel and through the collimator to cool it down after each shot. Ambient temp in atmosphere is going to have as much of an effect as vacuum, maybe more depending.

I dunno how hot it would get but considering that the rifle pack is good for 100 shots that could be pumped out over 16 minutes of steady fire you could probably toast a few marshmallows over the barrel.
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  #25  
Old July 26th, 2012, 06:29 PM
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To reconcile with Travaller ROFs, imagine each "shot" as a burst instead.

When a full-auto weapon is fired, you are taught to fire short bursts, not just hold down the trigger. Due to stress and poor training, that is why many assault rifles now have a 3-round burst option instead of full auto. The weapon fires the bursts for you. You don't have to remember to let off. When being taught to fire larger belt-fed weapons, I recall being told to fire "6 to 9 round bursts".

So, each shot with auto weapons could be considered a burst of several bullets. Without opening an old Traveller book I don't recall what this does to ammo capacities. If you go with bursts, you may have to cut down on ammo capacities. For example, a machinegun with a 100-round belt might actually be able to fire 20 5-shot bursts.

More complexity, but perhaps give a +1 DM when firing bursts to account for the extra bullets down range, but only when firing controlled bursts. Uncontrolled firing with the trigger held down for quite some time should only work for suppressive fire (which gives -DMs to opponents' actions?).
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  #26  
Old July 26th, 2012, 06:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sturn View Post
To reconcile with Travaller ROFs, imagine each "shot" as a burst instead.

When a full-auto weapon is fired, you are taught to fire short bursts, not just hold down the trigger. Due to stress and poor training, that is why many assault rifles now have a 3-round burst option instead of full auto. The weapon fires the bursts for you. You don't have to remember to let off. When being taught to fire larger belt-fed weapons, I recall being told to fire "6 to 9 round bursts".

So, each shot with auto weapons could be considered a burst of several bullets. Without opening an old Traveller book I don't recall what this does to ammo capacities. If you go with bursts, you may have to cut down on ammo capacities. For example, a machinegun with a 100-round belt might actually be able to fire 20 5-shot bursts.

More complexity, but perhaps give a +1 DM when firing bursts to account for the extra bullets down range, but only when firing controlled bursts. Uncontrolled firing with the trigger held down for quite some time should only work for suppressive fire (which gives -DMs to opponents' actions?).
Burst fire is already included in both the positive DM's for autofire weapons and the group hits rule (pg. 42, LBB1).

Panic fire is on page 32 of LBB4 (Mercenary) and is close to what Blue Ghost was wondering about I think.

"Suppression" fire could be modeled by using panic fire to activate it and adding the same negative DM the firing player has from using it to the opposing side's chances to hit during the same round. So basically one guy will be standing there screaming and blasting away with his gun while the opposing guys are diving for cover while trying to shoot back. For either side to hit anyone ends up being a "Hail-Mary" but it scares everyone silly and makes it easier for the side trying to escape or get to cover while the bad guys have their heads down. If anyone actually gets hit I would include a morale check to make sure that once the dust cleared everyone still has any will to combat left.

Or....you could just require that the magazine be emptied and the shooter has one chance to hit at -4DM as allowed for the weapon type at its highest setting (so a guass rifle would get 3 chances to hit at -4DM each) and the opposing side is automatically required to make a morale check. If they fail it (and don't run away or surrender) they lose a round of return fire since they are considered to be trying to make themselves very, very small while the rounds fly. That would give the advantage to the more experienced side and allow for the side using the suppression fire to gain time to escape or gain cover themselves.
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  #27  
Old July 27th, 2012, 11:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by far-trader View Post
And perhaps more the reason for the big laser weapon backpacks. Not so much power for the beam but coolants to keep the thing from melting down in vacuum use. How hot would a weapon grade laser weapon get?
Just make the components for it out of some ceramic material instead of metal. Then it could get incredibly hot and remain perfectly workable. Unlike a weapon using an explosive charge where you have shock to worry about here it is simply heat. Ceramics would be a great choice.
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  #28  
Old July 27th, 2012, 02:14 PM
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You still want to be able to hold it, rest it, perhaps sling or holster it without being burned or setting other materials on fire Cooling it in a reasonably short amount of time is still a good idea for a personal weapon. A little less so for a vehicle mounted one.
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Old July 27th, 2012, 07:48 PM
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Interesting, I am thinking about similar stuff in a game of Twilight:2000 I am running for my son and his pals this summer. I'm using v2 rules, in which autofire has an interesting mechanic.

I am relieved to learn that auto fire is inaccurate beyond short ranges, as the ammo-soaking involved in ranged or sustained fire seemed unbelievably high to me. So, I guess I won't invest my time in trying to write new rules or adapt others from other games.
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  #30  
Old July 27th, 2012, 09:51 PM
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Well, it's inaccurate with handheld weapons....but with emplaced machineguns of the LMG (and up) varieties it can be highly accurate - or at least they seem that way because they are A) designed and built to lay down high rates of fire and braced/heavy enough to not have muzzle climb affect the aim, and B) have a large ammunition capacity so they can lay down concentrated fire and sustain it for longer periods than some guy having to swap out mags every 4 seconds.

The caveat with the machineguns, though, is that they if they are not crew-served then they take longer to load and this leaves them vulnerable to counter-assault. A crew-served weapon can have the belts linked as they run out so the gun can (within the limits of its design) stay in the fight.

I believe the rules for all that are in LBB 4 (Mercenary) and possibly in Striker.

There is a Heavy machine Gun in JTAS #9 that has an interesting rule about sustained fire: you can fire the gun up to five bursts a round, but if (in the air-cooled version) you fire more than 3 times in a round it may jam, but with a water jacket there is a -3DM applied to the chance to jam so you can fire more rounds per turn.
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