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Old September 14th, 2011, 05:13 PM
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Default MT: Robots e-book

Hello all,

It been a while, but I've just purchased the MT: Robots (MT: R) product offered over at DriveThruRPG.com. I picked the Starship Maintenance Robot data sheet on p. 5 to test the design process and seem to be confused from the very start. I checked the design example in the Travellers' Digest Number 13 and Don McKinney's article: A MegaTraveller Starship Design Example Revisited V2.02, Updated 03/05/2008 to verify that I had the right idea on how to read the data sheet.

Per page 5 the Starship Maintenance Robot has a Displacement (UCP?) of 0.0196 and a volume of 371 liters. Using the Size table on MT: R p. 20 I cross referenced the Displacement of of 0.0196 which showed that the volume should be between 250 and 299 liters. Cross referencing on the volume of 371 liters has a UCP (Displacement?) is 0.026.

So, am I out to lunch on the design from the start?

Tom R
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Old September 15th, 2011, 05:41 AM
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Originally Posted by snrdg082102 View Post
Hello all,

It been a while, but I've just purchased the MT: Robots (MT: R) product offered over at DriveThruRPG.com. I picked the Starship Maintenance Robot data sheet on p. 5 to test the design process and seem to be confused from the very start. I checked the design example in the Travellers' Digest Number 13 and Don McKinney's article: A MegaTraveller Starship Design Example Revisited V2.02, Updated 03/05/2008 to verify that I had the right idea on how to read the data sheet.

Per page 5 the Starship Maintenance Robot has a Displacement (UCP?) of 0.0196 and a volume of 371 liters. Using the Size table on MT: R p. 20 I cross referenced the Displacement of of 0.0196 which showed that the volume should be between 250 and 299 liters. Cross referencing on the volume of 371 liters has a UCP (Displacement?) is 0.026.

So, am I out to lunch on the design from the start?

Tom R
No you're right and the listing is wrong. UCP 0.0196 is 274.8 l, and UCO 0.026 is 351 l.

Best regards,

Ewan
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Old September 16th, 2011, 12:26 AM
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Many apologies, Ewan is right, the displacement figure is wrong. The 'loads of robots' link in my signature takes you to a download of 108 designs including all of the examples I selected for the book. I stared at those figures for so long I've no doubt that errors have crept in!

Having said this, the UCP figure of displacement tons is a minor detail in the scheme of things. For any craft design, it is simply total kL / 13.5 or L / 13500. The main benefit for including the figure is a quick comparison to the size of craft in our standard Traveller lexicon. For craft design, litres and kilolitres are the queen of hull selection.

I'll check the source of the error when I get a chance.
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Old September 16th, 2011, 12:49 AM
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Originally Posted by E.D.Quibell View Post
No you're right and the listing is wrong. UCP 0.0196 is 274.8 l, and UCO 0.026 is 351 l.

Best regards,

Ewan
Evening Ewan,

Thanks for the reply and confirming that I wasn't out to lunch. ;-)


Tom R
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Old September 16th, 2011, 02:14 AM
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Many apologies, Ewan is right, the displacement figure is wrong. The 'loads of robots' link in my signature takes you to a download of 108 designs including all of the examples I selected for the book. I stared at those figures for so long I've no doubt that errors have crept in!

Having said this, the UCP figure of displacement tons is a minor detail in the scheme of things. For any craft design, it is simply total kL / 13.5 or L / 13500. The main benefit for including the figure is a quick comparison to the size of craft in our standard Traveller lexicon. For craft design, litres and kilolitres are the queen of hull selection.

I'll check the source of the error when I get a chance.
Evening OjnoTheRed,

Thank you also for the reply and the link to the robot catalog.

I agree that the Displacement/UCP is a minor detail in the scheme of things. Unfortunately, I dislike not being able to recreate a design using the construction system. In an effort to work through the example I created a no frills spreadsheet that can be used work from a given Volume to a UCP/Size/Displ, Weight, and Price. A standard and non-standard UCP/Size/Displ can also be entered to get the factor, per MT: RM p. 62 to determine volume, weight, and price.

Another silly question which might be more errata. The Elite Valet on MT: R p. 33 has a Config=AUS. MT: R p. 20 1-3 Configuration table has Type codes of C = Contoured and B = Pseudo-biological.

Should the Contoured Type code be A instead of C in the Configuration table on MT: R p. 20?

Tom R
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Old September 16th, 2011, 03:17 AM
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Thanks again - yes, it should read "CUS" not "AUS". This was because I originally put "A" for "Contoured" and "B" for "Pseudo-bio" but then adopted Rob Prior's "C" for "Contoured" and "B" for "Pseudo-bio". But, of course, forgot to update some of the designs!

Having re-read my previous post, sorry, that "minor detail" comment sounded like a bit of a crack at you. Many apologies. What I was trying to get across was some encouragement to say that you're on the right track, just go with the volume over the UCP dTon figure and it should work out.

I'll make changes as necessary to the spreadsheet and update it on my box.net account.
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Old September 16th, 2011, 03:57 AM
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OK, one more post.

Firstly, I found the source of the error in relation to UCP displacement. The particular robot concerned has a base hull volume of 265 litres. This was the basis of calculating dTons for the UCP value of 0.0196 (= 265 / 13500). But one must add the turret (i.e. head) at 40% which gives 265 x 1.4 = 371 litres. This latter figure gives the actual dTons displacement of 0.0275. I have updated the calculations for all robots to reflect volume of the hull including the head rather than excluding it as before.

Secondly, designating the configs as AUS was a mistake for all contoured robots in the spreadsheet! I've updated it universally to CUS.

Lastly, it should be noted that I simply cut-and-paste from the calculated design evaluations in this spreadsheet straight into the supplement. So the evaluations are automatically updated in the spreadsheet that is linked in my signature block. Feel free to download and have a look. I've uploaded the updated version. By way of a guide, the designs chosen for the supplement (to represent an example of several different kinds of design) can be found as follows:

p. 5 Starship Maintenance Robot - sheet "33. Starport Mechanic Robot"
p. 7 Animal Care Robot - sheet "1. Animal Care Robot"
p. 9 Imperial Raider Drone - sheet "109. Robot Raider" (well, yes, I was busily watching my Battlestar Galactica DVD collection when designing this one! So say we all.)
p. 10 Automated Scout - sheet "108. Automated Scout"
p. 12 Janitor Bot - sheet "7. Janitorbot"
p. 13 Agricultural Slave Robot - sheet "49. Agricultural Slave Robot"
p. 14 Agricultural Master Robot - sheet "50. Agricultural Master Robot"
p. 15 Security Robot - sheet "70. Security Robot"
p. 18 Basic Bartender Bot - sheet "3. Bartender Bot"
p. 19 Undersea Harvester Robot - sheet "12. Undersea Harvester Robot"
p. 33 Elite Valet / Rashush Model 1 - sheet "62. Rashush Model 1"
p. 36 Prospector Robot - sheet "54. Prospector Robot"

The spreadsheet is in OpenDocument spreadsheet format (*.ods) which also opens in Microsoft Excel 2007 and 2010 (I can't vouch for earlier versions). The spreadsheet contains transparent calculations for a total of 111 designs plus full design evaluations for each robot. Enjoy!
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Old September 16th, 2011, 09:54 AM
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Morning OjnoTheRed,

Good thing I asked about the coding for the Robot Configurations since I'm also working on an Excel 2000 spreadsheet, okay another one ;-), for the vehicle sized robots. I had already entered CUS as the code.

I didn't think the comment of "minor detail" was a crack against me, so there is no issue or apologies needed. I'm one of the types that like to be able to recreate an established design using the games construction sequence. If my efforts return a different result than the example I'm using I try to figure out what is out of whack. In this case I hadn't figured out where I was off track.

Also thanks for the errata update and link to the Rech System write-up. Unfortunately, I'm not rich enough to upgrade my MS Office Suite 2000 to anything more up to date. I haven't been able to open the Open Office file extension so I may have to get Open Office.

Tom R
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Last edited by snrdg082102; September 18th, 2011 at 09:58 AM.. Reason: corrected grammar error
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Old September 16th, 2011, 12:31 PM
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I haven't been able to open the Open Office file extension so I may have to get Open Office.
Mwa ha ha ha ha. All part of my dastardly plan to get you all to use an open rather than proprietary format. Now I can lock you into my business plan to get you to use software for free! Wait, there's a weakness in this plan I haven't seen yet ...

More seriously. This is a PDF version of the same thing (it's about 750Kb). One calculation / robot evaluation per page, just so you can at least see the figures.
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Old September 16th, 2011, 02:51 PM
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Originally Posted by OjnoTheRed View Post
Mwa ha ha ha ha. All part of my dastardly plan to get you all to use an open rather than proprietary format. Now I can lock you into my business plan to get you to use software for free! Wait, there's a weakness in this plan I haven't seen yet ...

More seriously. This is a PDF version of the same thing (it's about 750Kb). One calculation / robot evaluation per page, just so you can at least see the figures.
Not a weakness from my point of view;-). I'm not in a position to upgrade to the latest MS product. Unfortunately, I've got a few items created in Word and Excel. I discovered I wasn't very good at using Access, except during a class where the example actually worked. When I tried on my own things didn't work as well.

Thanks for the link to the updated 100+ Robots PDF document, unfortunately the button to download the file on the web page appears to be broken. Here is what happens:

I tried downloading from the link "This" is a PDF version the download button showing (745.5 KB). After downloading was completed I hit the Open button and got an error message saying that the file couldn't be opened or fixed. The icon showed a file size of 75 KB.

Selecting the Save as button in IE the file is saved with a size of 745 KB and opens just fine.

I downloaded the document that is linked to "And loads of robots" by clicking on the download (783.4 KB) yesterday without a problem.

Trying to reverse engineer something like the Starship Maintenance Robot using the data provided in MT: R usually has me asking questions. The 108 Robots document you provide is a real big help, since I can verify my numbers to ensure I've got the hang of the design sequence. In this case I forgot that the head (turret) added to the total volume.

Thank you for the work you put into ensuring that someone like me can actually follow the steps instead of guessing.


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