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Old January 16th, 2009, 04:01 AM
Poppyseed45 Poppyseed45 is offline
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Default Do you add tax for "goods" transactions?

Specifically, when players are buying and selling goods across worlds, do you levy a customs charge or tariff?

Unless I missed it in the rules, there doesn't seem to be any...which means how does the Imperium make money if not through import and export tariffs? (it isn't by direct taxation).

Thoughts?
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Old January 16th, 2009, 04:28 AM
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Generally, I presume that local prices includ all applicable taxes. If one chooses to evade taxes, an uncertain roll is made, and if successful, a DM+1 is gained for evading the taxman... on a fail, however, Excrement Occurrs in Large Quantity.

IMTU, most of the imperium is run off of taxation of worlds, and the rest by licensure via stock ownership of interstellar businesses. (The license to operate in a given see will run you about 1% of your ownership in stocks... if you can convince the relevant nobles to issue said license.) Single ship enterprises don't generally get hit, since ship licensure is one of the costs of annual maintenance IMTU.
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Old January 16th, 2009, 08:10 AM
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I might agree completely, though say it a bit differently. Those running starports, and shipping goods through the exclusion lines pay something like a VAT, that is transparent to those inside. The idea is that once goods are inside imperium territory, stellar commerce bears no tax burden. The commissioning of starships and equipment (especially weaponry) has a VAT built in, as do maintenance services, down to a .5% on refined fuel.

If characters are buying goods on the local economy, and shipping them through interstellar trade, then there is a percentage tax that equals the + DM for the best sale market for those goods, based on the trade tables. Which may be as low as 0%.
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Old January 16th, 2009, 08:52 AM
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Originally Posted by aramis View Post
IMTU, most of the imperium is run off of taxation of worlds, and the rest by licensure via stock ownership of interstellar businesses. (The license to operate in a given see will run you about 1% of your ownership in stocks... if you can convince the relevant nobles to issue said license.) Single ship enterprises don't generally get hit, since ship licensure is one of the costs of annual maintenance IMTU.
According to GT:Nobles, one of the conditions of getting a Limited liability Imperial Charter is that a 2% share of the company (known as the Emperor's Share) must be given to the Emperor (who can then dispose of it as he see fit; usually he keeps ownership but assigns the control of the stock to one of his nobles). Ships owned by individuals does not need a charter to engage in interstellar trade, but companies do. (I noticed that the Imperial family owned a minimum of 2% of every company for which we had share ownership information (except one megacorporation, Instellarms) and suggested this to Loren and Jon).

Note that the Emperor can buy more stock if he wants to, and evidently can even dispose of his share, although he probably does not do the last very often. I'm sure there's a fascinating story why the Emperor no longer owns stock in Instellarms, but I have no idea what it is.


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Old January 16th, 2009, 10:31 AM
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Doesn't the Emperor own

Spoiler:
Imperiallines?
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Old January 17th, 2009, 03:19 AM
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Hmm...so the consensus seems to be that the tax is already "figured into" the prices of the trading rules and such. Also IMTU, I imagined that these tariffs and what not where the money-pit of the Imperium, with the occasional bit of "fines and fees" at starports and the like to round it out.

Interesting stuff all. Thanks.
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Old January 17th, 2009, 03:58 AM
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Tax exists, it's just too boring to include in the trade rules.

Similarly where are the rules for insuring ships and cargo? They don't exist either within the rules but I would imagine the worlds of the imperium do offer such services
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Old January 17th, 2009, 06:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spinward Scout View Post
Doesn't the Emperor own

Spoiler:
Imperiallines?
Of course not. Whatever gave you that idea? The name? That doesn't mean a thing. It is owned by a holding company that can not, under any circumstances, be traced back to the Imperial Household.

(Actually, CT and MT sources contradict each other (Surprise! ). An attempt to reconcile the two versions can be found here: http://traveller.wikia.com/wiki/Imperiallines).


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Old January 17th, 2009, 02:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mencelus View Post
Specifically, when players are buying and selling goods across worlds, do you levy a customs charge or tariff?

Unless I missed it in the rules, there doesn't seem to be any...which means how does the Imperium make money if not through import and export tariffs? (it isn't by direct taxation).

Thoughts?
There is a CT JTAS article that speaks to importing/exporting goods and local currency (not quite tax, but close).

To keep it simple, in my games, I just use a round number.

What I may do, though (as suggested by the article I cite above) is raise and lower standard prices on goods depending on where the PCs are.

And, if the story requires (or permits), I'll nag them will little things like the air tax mentioned in The Traveller Adventure on Aramis.



I'll also look at long term miscellaneous expenses. I'll take the long term expenditure, based on their SOC (from The Traveller Book), and I'll remove the number of days they character spent aboard ship (in jump and normal operations), and then charge the character that amount for the month.

I'll do this monthly in a campaign, representing all the little odds and ends, drinks, clothes, nic-knacks, stuff that a person will buy.

As we game, if it's a small expendature: "I'll buy the NPC a drink." I'll just say, "Don't worry about marking off the credits. We'll call it part of your monthly expenses."

OTOH, if the PC ends up making contact with the black market and purchasing some weapons and ammo, I won't count that against monthly expense. The PC will have to spend the credits.
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Old January 18th, 2009, 05:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Supplement Four View Post

I'll also look at long term miscellaneous expenses. I'll take the long term expenditure, based on their SOC (from The Traveller Book), and I'll remove the number of days they character spent aboard ship (in jump and normal operations), and then charge the character that amount for the month.

I'll do this monthly in a campaign, representing all the little odds and ends, drinks, clothes, nic-knacks, stuff that a person will buy.

As we game, if it's a small expendature: "I'll buy the NPC a drink." I'll just say, "Don't worry about marking off the credits. We'll call it part of your monthly expenses."

OTOH, if the PC ends up making contact with the black market and purchasing some weapons and ammo, I won't count that against monthly expense. The PC will have to spend the credits.
Yes, naturally. I already do this to some extent, especially as I'm not into bean counting - which is why I like the rules for "monthly expenses" and such not.

As for the tariff/tax thing, I'm not wanting to add up a bunch of stuff, just wanted to see if it exists and if so, how? Again, I imagined it one way, seems that it is there, but abstracted in the name of playability, which is fine. Just want to be able to answer when it comes up (and with my group, for certain it will).
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