Traveller Store CotI Features New Posts Mark Forums Read Register


Go Back TravellerRPG.com > Citizens of the Imperium > Other Versions of Traveller > MegaTraveller

MegaTraveller Discuss of the MegaTraveller ruleset and the Rebellion Milieu

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #21  
Old September 23rd, 2011, 12:52 AM
snrdg082102's Avatar
snrdg082102 snrdg082102 is offline
Citizen: SOC-14
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Roy, WA 98580
Posts: 2,480
Gallery : 0
snrdg082102 Citizen+snrdg082102 Citizen+
Default

I've gotten a little side tracked by CT: Book 8 Robots and a spreadsheet I found by Andrew Akins. I'm still working my way through MT: Robots while creating a spreadsheet in Excel and Calc. Of course learning OpenOffice Calc while building a spreadsheet has helped in slowing me down.
__________________
Tom Rux
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old October 13th, 2011, 10:57 AM
Murdoc's Avatar
Murdoc Murdoc is offline
Citizen: SOC-12
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 475
Gallery : 0
Murdoc Citizen
Default

I got a quick question. Love the book by the way.

Why do the robots go so fast? I mean, the Starship Maintenance Robot can go 259 kph. Why would it need to go that fast? I doubt that it could even get up to that speed on most ships (unless huge capital ships had long hallways with no people in them). And the Rashush goes 222 kph. Why? Is that even technically possible on legs? And it seems like most are like that. Basic Bartender: 179. I'm not criticizing anyone, just wondering if there is a reason here I don't know about.
__________________
IMTU Code
tc+ tm++ !tn t4-- t5+ ?tp tg t20-- ru+ ge+ 3i jt au ls pi ?ta he kk-- hi++ as va dr++ so++ zh+ vi da+
My T5 House Rules; some fixes, mostly enhancements.
BladeMaker2 - Now a real T5 'Maker' for melee weapons from TL 0-20, with options, materials, sizes, etc.!
T5 Aerodynamics Rules - For ship hull configurations, realistic re-entry, etc.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old October 13th, 2011, 04:05 PM
snrdg082102's Avatar
snrdg082102 snrdg082102 is offline
Citizen: SOC-14
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Roy, WA 98580
Posts: 2,480
Gallery : 0
snrdg082102 Citizen+snrdg082102 Citizen+
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Murdoc View Post
I got a quick question. Love the book by the way.

Why do the robots go so fast? I mean, the Starship Maintenance Robot can go 259 kph. Why would it need to go that fast? I doubt that it could even get up to that speed on most ships (unless huge capital ships had long hallways with no people in them). And the Rashush goes 222 kph. Why? Is that even technically possible on legs? And it seems like most are like that. Basic Bartender: 179. I'm not criticizing anyone, just wondering if there is a reason here I don't know about.
Howdy Murdoc,

My best guess is that by the time OjnoTheRed got to testing the spreadsheet the mind and eyes were a bit glazed over. I haven't gotten to that step yet, I'm trying to come to terms with the price of a 2000 and 3000 liter robot in the chassis table compared to the Vehicle table in MT: RM. Not to mention modifying the spreadsheet to include batteries and fusion power plants shown in CT Book 8 Robots.

Of course I could be OTL.

Cheers
__________________
Tom Rux
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old October 13th, 2011, 04:16 PM
Timmy Timmy is offline
Citizen: SOC-7
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Christchurch
Posts: 28
Gallery : 0
Timmy Citizen
Default

Its kind of like the Sepoy armoured personell carrier in 101 vehicles, When it was being designed, an appropriate speed and level of armour was not selected, so it ended up being far too big and heavy. With the use of spread sheets, these things can be trimmed back to more appropriate values and the whole unit made smaller, or given greater capacity for other functions. Consider that a vallet robot should be approximately as fast as the persons that it serves.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old October 13th, 2011, 04:38 PM
snrdg082102's Avatar
snrdg082102 snrdg082102 is offline
Citizen: SOC-14
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Roy, WA 98580
Posts: 2,480
Gallery : 0
snrdg082102 Citizen+snrdg082102 Citizen+
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Timmy View Post
Its kind of like the Sepoy armoured personnel carrier in 101 vehicles, When it was being designed, an appropriate speed and level of armour was not selected, so it ended up being far too big and heavy. With the use of spread sheets, these things can be trimmed back to more appropriate values and the whole unit made smaller, or given greater capacity for other functions. Consider that a valet robot should be approximately as fast as the persons that it serves.
Afternoon Timmy,

Thanks for the reply, I have paged through my copy of 101 Vehicles and did some primary testing, unfortunately I got distracted by something else and the project is in limbo.

At some point I hope to have a modified spreadsheet from OjnoTheRed's link or and Excel 2000 spreadsheet to work from. My only problem is distractions like extrapolation. If I get OjnoTheRed's spreadsheet automated he'll be getting the draft to check over.
__________________
Tom Rux
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old October 13th, 2011, 06:52 PM
OjnoTheRed's Avatar
OjnoTheRed OjnoTheRed is offline
Citizen: SOC-13
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 765
Gallery : 17
Visit OjnoTheRed's Blog
OjnoTheRed Citizen+OjnoTheRed Citizen+
Default

Hi all. The speeds are a feature of the Referee's Manual Design evaluation. Even after modifying the design evaluation process to only use the power left over from other components, at the higher techs for these designs, you get massive speed bonuses. Because most of the robots are small and light, the power-to-weight ratio is usually very good to start with, even with fuel cells where you've already used all but a few kilowatts of power.

So, yeah, robots at TL 12 or so with contact based suspensions are waaaay over powered for their purpose, but believe it or not, it's actually an existing quirk in the craft design system.

When considering the impact on the in-game universe, I visualise robots as having the capability for frightening bursts of speed, as a result of almost magical hi-tech transmissions and suspensions (consider that in-game, we are living at around TL8, maybe TL9 for computers), and our world would look like magic to someone who fast forwarded from the 1960's (around TL6). So now fast forward another 3-5 TL's - what does our society look like?

I'll finish on this note: what Traveller provides in this regard is a framework for imagining a future society in a lot of detail. That's what makes the design sequence fun for me, and I suspect, a lot of my fellow Travellers.
__________________
OjnoTheRed's T5 Personals Playing Aide and Rules Variation.

Generate 1,000,001 characters for the Cepheus Engine rules.

Generate a World Map or Star System using the Traveller5 rules.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old October 13th, 2011, 08:53 PM
snrdg082102's Avatar
snrdg082102 snrdg082102 is offline
Citizen: SOC-14
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Roy, WA 98580
Posts: 2,480
Gallery : 0
snrdg082102 Citizen+snrdg082102 Citizen+
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by OjnoTheRed View Post
Hi all. The speeds are a feature of the Referee's Manual Design evaluation. Even after modifying the design evaluation process to only use the power left over from other components, at the higher techs for these designs, you get massive speed bonuses. Because most of the robots are small and light, the power-to-weight ratio is usually very good to start with, even with fuel cells where you've already used all but a few kilowatts of power.

So, yeah, robots at TL 12 or so with contact based suspensions are waaaay over powered for their purpose, but believe it or not, it's actually an existing quirk in the craft design system.

When considering the impact on the in-game universe, I visualise robots as having the capability for frightening bursts of speed, as a result of almost magical hi-tech transmissions and suspensions (consider that in-game, we are living at around TL8, maybe TL9 for computers), and our world would look like magic to someone who fast forwarded from the 1960's (around TL6). So now fast forward another 3-5 TL's - what does our society look like?

I'll finish on this note: what Traveller provides in this regard is a framework for imagining a future society in a lot of detail. That's what makes the design sequence fun for me, and I suspect, a lot of my fellow Travellers.
I kind of like a fast robot, I mean look how fast the thing can move when the ship comes crashing down;-)
__________________
Tom Rux
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old October 13th, 2011, 09:28 PM
Murdoc's Avatar
Murdoc Murdoc is offline
Citizen: SOC-12
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 475
Gallery : 0
Murdoc Citizen
Default

Ok I get it; thanks guys. Yeah, the MT-RM's vehicle rules were great in most respects, but certainly weird when it came to legs. I mean, leg volume based on total PP output? I got some weird results with that one.

Anyway, I'll still get much fun out of it. Thanks for all your work!
__________________
IMTU Code
tc+ tm++ !tn t4-- t5+ ?tp tg t20-- ru+ ge+ 3i jt au ls pi ?ta he kk-- hi++ as va dr++ so++ zh+ vi da+
My T5 House Rules; some fixes, mostly enhancements.
BladeMaker2 - Now a real T5 'Maker' for melee weapons from TL 0-20, with options, materials, sizes, etc.!
T5 Aerodynamics Rules - For ship hull configurations, realistic re-entry, etc.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old October 13th, 2011, 11:13 PM
OjnoTheRed's Avatar
OjnoTheRed OjnoTheRed is offline
Citizen: SOC-13
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 765
Gallery : 17
Visit OjnoTheRed's Blog
OjnoTheRed Citizen+OjnoTheRed Citizen+
Default

No worries Murdoc. Just to clarify about leg-volume though: bear in mind there are two components: the legs themselves (the "suspension" - defined as what the craft rests upon), and the transmission (which "transmits" the power from the power source to the suspension).

It is transmission volume that is based on power used: that is to say, the more power going from the power plant to the wheels/tracks/legs, the heavier/bulkier the transmission you'll need. At higher tech levels, materials and engineering are assumed to improve and so less transmission is needed for a given unit of power.

The design evaluation in the Referee's Manual is based on total power output because - let's face it - in a contact-based vehicle, the power plant's basic role is to provide the power necessary for locomotion. When you put the pedal-to-the-metal, you don't want the transmission to break! Just note that when you do that in a high-tech vehicle where the wheels are backed by megawatts of fusion power, the results are going to be somewhat ... exhilarating.

For robots I created the (admittedly total PITA rule) that left over power, not total power is used for calculating transmission and speeds. I justify this by saying that is because regardless of power going to locomotion when needed, the robot's brain and other functions must keep operating; in meta-game terms it's actually because the resulting transmission volume / weight and speeds became even more unworkable for robots. Technically we might apply such a rule to all craft, but for contact-based vehicles all other functions are generally trivial compared to locomotion, and so for the sake of making the design rules workable, total power is used. For thrust-based vehicles, power is allocated per unit of locomotion needed anyway.

So I hope that clarifies something that might seem a bit strange at first glance.
__________________
OjnoTheRed's T5 Personals Playing Aide and Rules Variation.

Generate 1,000,001 characters for the Cepheus Engine rules.

Generate a World Map or Star System using the Traveller5 rules.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Squaring Robots Book 8 with Mega Traveller OjnoTheRed MegaTraveller 156 September 13th, 2011 09:04 AM
Yet more robots (CT/MT) ChalkLine Ship's Locker 0 July 31st, 2007 09:49 AM
Book 8 Robots official errata?? Maladominus Classic Traveller 9 March 3rd, 2006 11:33 AM

This website and its contents are copyright ©2010- Far Future Enterprises. All rights reserved. Traveller is a registered trademark of Far Future Enterprises .
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright (c) 2010-2013, Far Future Enterprises. All Rights Reserved.