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Cepheus General General discussion of Cepheus Engine products.

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  #11  
Old November 28th, 2018, 12:26 AM
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I think the question answers itself, and is rooted more in the economics section then ship design.
If your ship cost exceeds the ability to make a profit, it's built to fail for mercantile activity.
However if your ship can get run down by even just moonlighting part time pirates, that is the ultimate price to pay.

So a lot depends on your setting, the general ability to make money, how much more money you can make going to dangerous areas, how much safety vs. danger is baked into your setting, and if you have adjusted the pay appropriately.


As I have mentioned before, I think CT had a specific mercantile path to start out then improve and fit out your ship for harsher threat areas.
The CT 77 encounter table in particular set up a greater wealth/greater risk paradigm trying to get to those A/B starports, however counter-intuitive that may have been.
So whatever your sense of 'reality' or preferred setting may be, I'd look hard at threat/risk vs. reward and financing extra goods to carry.

The CT cost sink of the computers and programs are not particularly there for CE and the sensor fits are generally too cheap to worry about.
So one cost sink to consider is ship insurance.
At a certain risk level ships may not be insured without being armed, like CT subsidized mail requirement.
Conversely, you could charge more for armed ships as they are more likely to go in harm's way.
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  #12  
Old November 28th, 2018, 12:34 AM
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One other thought- I took the critiques to heart about surface vs. interior volume, and now 'charge' a higher percentage of volume for smaller ships to get armored, and bigger ships get 'charged' less percentage.


So the ACS ships being unarmored on average makes sense.
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Old November 28th, 2018, 01:13 AM
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I would certainly recommend you buy the Spacecraft Design Guide if you want more detail.
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  #14  
Old November 28th, 2018, 01:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timerover51 View Post
Actually, in my sector, both Jump Drive and Hyperdrive is used. However, Hyperspace Drives are considerably slower than the Jump Drive. Hyperspace Drive 1 covers a parsec in a month. Hyperspace Drive 2 covers a parsec in a week. If you need speed, you use the Jump Drive. For range, or simple cargo hauling, the Hyperspace Drive is used. The Jump-2 Far Trader and a Jump-3 600 dTon Subsidized Merchant are widely used. The Rim Scouts and Space Vikings use Hyperdrive-2 ships, while there are a lot of Hyperdrive-1 ships still in use. Small colonies like them as they are cheap to acquire or charter, and tend to be reasonably good size. In a sense, it is like the current transportation system in the Real World, where if you need something somewhere fast, it goes by air. If speed is not critical, then ship it by sea.
Remember to check your math for actual operational costs per ton per parsec.

Lots of game designers have failed the due diligence there.
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Old November 28th, 2018, 02:13 PM
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Originally Posted by aramis View Post
Remember to check your math for actual operational costs per ton per parsec.

Lots of game designers have failed the due diligence there.
I will be crunching the numbers most carefully.
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Old November 28th, 2018, 03:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timerover51 View Post
One thing has always puzzled me in the ship construction rules, and looking over the Cepheus Engine rules maybe increases that. The main difference between a merchant ship and a warship is that the merchant ship has either passenger space or cargo space or both.
It reflects the sentiment in 70s era science fiction that any ship can be a weapon particularly considering the drives.

For example in Larry Niven's Known Space universe the First Man-Kzin War was in part was won because humans were using atomic torch drives. Any time they needed to make an attack they just turn the drive end of the ship towards the enemy and ignited the drive.

That that we are a couple of more decades into thinking about this stuff as well as continued developments in manned spaceflight there is a greater diversity in how to approach this.
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Old November 28th, 2018, 03:44 PM
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Originally Posted by madmike View Post
I would certainly recommend you buy the Spacecraft Design Guide if you want more detail.
I actually want to simplify ship design a bit.
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  #18  
Old November 28th, 2018, 04:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by estar View Post
It reflects the sentiment in 70s era science fiction that any ship can be a weapon particularly considering the drives.

For example in Larry Niven's Known Space universe the First Man-Kzin War was in part was won because humans were using atomic torch drives. Any time they needed to make an attack they just turn the drive end of the ship towards the enemy and ignited the drive.

That that we are a couple of more decades into thinking about this stuff as well as continued developments in manned spaceflight there is a greater diversity in how to approach this.
I have read and have in hard copy most of Niven's Know Space series, so I am aware of the use of drives as weapons. However, that is an integral part of the ship, not an add-on item of equipment. We also had a fairly recent demonstration of the weaponization of commercial jet airliners.

Madmike is closer with his Age of Sail analogy of merchant ships with some armament for defensive purposes against pirates, hostile natives, or similar groups of ill intent. Even in the Age of Sail, there were clear distinctions in ship building design between merchant ships and warships. The big East Indiamen blurred that to an extent, being close to a lightly built two-deck ship of the line, but even then carried a lighter armament on the upper gun deck than a 74-gun ship, and were not as strongly built. Some armament can be justified, but the distinction between civilian and military ships should be a lot greater than it is in the Cepheus Engine rules.
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  #19  
Old November 28th, 2018, 04:59 PM
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Civilian - hull, controls, drives, fuel, cargo, crew, staterooms, hardpoints for turret weapons, carried craft/vehicles
Military - hull, armour, screens, EW, controls, drives, fuel, fuel treatment (or military spec drives), crew, staterooms, cargo/stores, hardpoints for turret weapons, bay weapons or setting equivalent, spinal mounts or their setting equivalents, carried craft/vehicles, ship's troops
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Old November 29th, 2018, 10:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike wightman View Post
Civilian - hull, controls, drives, fuel, cargo, crew, staterooms, hardpoints for turret weapons, carried craft/vehicles
Military - hull, armour, screens, EW, controls, drives, fuel, fuel treatment (or military spec drives), crew, staterooms, cargo/stores, hardpoints for turret weapons, bay weapons or setting equivalent, spinal mounts or their setting equivalents, carried craft/vehicles, ship's troops
The wiki started collecting this kind of data here:
http://wiki.travellerrpg.com/Ship_Equipment

It may be of use to you.

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