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  #11  
Old March 9th, 2016, 09:52 AM
maksimsmelchak maksimsmelchak is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robject View Post
[I think that Hard Times is a fantastic RPG supplement because]
  • it gives you rules but also descriptions of what it really meant to live in the Hard Times during the Rebellion
  • and lots of situations that'd come about because of it;
  • rules on low-tech stopgap stuff,
  • rules on when a society breaks down this is the kind of thing that happens on the level that matters to player-characters not Admirals and Emperors, etc.
[I consider Path of Tears to be one of the best RPG supplements ever made for any system because]
  • here's a UPP,
  • this is the situation on the world that is described by that UPP,
  • and here's how the players can get involved.
    But there's more,
  • here's ideas for further adventures that would come about because of what the players did, etc.
  • If you didn't like that world, here's another world with the same treatment.
  • And another.
  • And another.

Thank you for taking the time to explain yourself further. It helps me.
I love the background as a Traveller fan, but I tend to agree:

An RPG book probably ought to be a game reference first.
  • It needs concrete example to engender game play.
  • It needs numerical and text representations (samples, adventures, etc.) to bring it alive.
  • It should have just enough back story to make the story happen and leave out un-needed background details unless they are setting the story for a later plotline or story arc.

And the artwork and illustrations are very important. they are the biggest aids in helping players visualize the universe. How does the saying go: " A picture is worth a thousand words."

That is something I find very vexing about so many of the Traveller races... Minimal pictures. I am having to research all the time to flesh out and fill in the gaps on Traveller species.

Been doing the same with Traveller polities, corporations, sector economies and sectors in general, etc.

That's the beauty of forums and the Wiki. It makes it very easy to build a universe bible for the story.

Shalom,
Maksim-Smelchak.

Last edited by maksimsmelchak; March 9th, 2016 at 01:03 PM..
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  #12  
Old March 9th, 2016, 11:17 AM
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Aside from having the usual GURPS problem (altering Traveller to fit GURPS instead of altering GURPS to fit Traveller) it is a fine book as long as one understands that the coverage of the era is a bit fluid. The book starts by concentrating on near Earth and mid-IW as a role-playing setting, but does address the earlier years and then goes on to provide both a timeline and some mechanical assistance to play up to the final surrender of the Vilani Empire.
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Old March 11th, 2016, 03:11 AM
David Johansen David Johansen is offline
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Spoiler, it turns out that the Beowulf class free trader originated as a Villani design that roughly translated to "sandwich" which got skewed to "hero" by the Terrans.

It's an okay book. I don't think I'd ever run it. I've never liked the way they handled the technology conversion. I'd argue that TL 10 - 15 are GURPS 3e TL 9 with various specific technologies added in. In GURPS 4e, lasers are TL10 so I'd probably make Traveller late nine to early ten plus jump drives and antigravity. The problem is that the armor and computers are much too good at higher GURPS Tech levels.

Anyhow, I'd put it on par with Mileu 0 and First Survey in terms of building a setting without really capturing anything that would make one want to set their game in the period. It's better edited and designed of course. One thing SJG gets right is the importance of editing and indexing.

Now if they could just wrap their head around the reasons they need a one book generic fantasy point of entry product. They have an sf one in GURPS Vorkosigian though I expect the setting puts off more people than it brings in. Generic is a strength that SJG doesn't seem to respect quite enough. But like many rpgs these days, the point of entry cost to do something like Generic Fantasy is simply too high to draw in new customers.

A mistake I hope isn't made with T5.
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  #14  
Old March 16th, 2016, 12:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whulorigan View Post
The GURPS TLs were rescaled for 4th Edition. In 4E, GTL11 = ~TTL14-16. In fact, GTL12 in 4E is as high as the TL Scale goes, and is ultratech "magic" - Traveller's Ancients and/or the Galaxiad would fall under GTL12 in 4E.
Your comparisons are a bit different. GT:IW in itself make no references to the Ultra-Tech books or higher Traveller tech much.

GT:IW specifically uses the the GURPS 4 scale found in the 4E Campaigns Book pg. 511, as noted in GT:IW pg. 159. No mods from Ultra-Tech are referenced anywhere in the GT:IW book:
From Campaigns p. 511
TL0 – Stone Age (Prehistory and later). Counting; oral tradition.
TL1 – Bronze Age (3500 B.C.+). Arithmetic; writing.
TL2 – Iron Age (1200 B.C.+). Geometry; scrolls.
TL3 – Medieval (600 A.D.+). Algebra; books.
TL4 – Age of Sail (1450+). Calculus; movable type.
TL5 – Industrial Revolution (1730+). Mechanical calculators; telegraph.
TL6 – Mechanized Age (1880+). Electrical calculators; telephone and radio.
TL7 – Nuclear Age (1940+). Mainframe computers; television.
TL8 – Digital Age (1980+). Personal computers; global networks.
TL9 – Microtech Age (2025+?). Artificial intelligence; real-time virtuality.
TL10 – Robotic Age (2070+?). Nanotechnology or other advances start to blur distinctions between technologies . . .
TL11 – Age of Exotic Matter.
TL12 – Whatever the GM likes!
The technological assumptions are GURPS. The thing to keep in mind, you are shoehorning Traveller to conform to GURPS, so YMMV.


Once the items from IW and the basic books are factored in, the chart changes to
TL0 – Stone Age (Prehistory and later). Counting; oral tradition.
TL1 – Bronze Age (3500 B.C.+). Arithmetic; writing.
TL2 – Iron Age (1200 B.C.+). Geometry; scrolls.
TL3 – Medieval (600 A.D.+). Algebra; books.
TL4 – Age of Sail (1450+). Calculus; movable type.
TL5 – Industrial Revolution (1730+). Mechanical calculators; telegraph.
TL6 – Mechanized Age (1880+). Electrical calculators; telephone and radio.
TL7 – Nuclear Age (1940+). Mainframe computers; television.
TL8 – Digital Age (1980+). Personal computers; global networks.
TL9 – (2025-2127) Pre-Jump Colonization to 2nd ISW. Jump 1; Lasers (Beam and Pulse), Heavy Particle Guns
TL10 – (2128-2235) 2nd ISW-8th ISW. Max Vilani TL. Jump 2; Light Particle and Spinal Particle, Plasma Guns; Repulsors
TL11 – (2236+?) 8th ISW+. Jump 3; Spinal Meson Cannon, Fusion Guns
TL12 – Whatever the GM likes! (?? Jump 4, Jump 5, Jump 6, Dampers and Screens)

History ends in 2303. Hiroshi Estigarribia is given a bio, but his becoming emperor is hinted ("beyond the scope of this book")

The exact years for TL 9-11 for Terrans is from GT:IW p. 130 World Generation. The max TL a world may have depends on the year you generated the world for. The Max for Vilani worlds is always 10.
There are no references to Jump 4, 5, or 6, dampers or screens, so TL 12. Repulsors to deflect missiles exist

And on a humorous note Vilani TL is 10, except for Medical Knowledge which is stuck at TL 7 (GT:IW 160).
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  #15  
Old March 16th, 2016, 04:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nathan Brazil View Post
Once the items from IW and the basic books are factored in, the chart changes to <snipped>
That's not really very far off from the rest of Traveller. A little jinking to and fro but more or less compatible. Subdivide GTL12 and Jack's a doughnut:

GTL 12.1 - GTL 12.22 = TTL 13 through TTL 34.

Or, if you're more inclined to compromise, limit TL11 to Jump 2, back up GTL12 to equal TTL12, and then use the Traveller TLs from 13 on up. It compromises SJG's vision of how TLs work (with modern-day Earth TL as the inflection point) in favor of Traveller's TL tree.
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Old March 16th, 2016, 06:11 PM
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It's closer to:
GTISW....CT
TL11......TL12
TL11.2...TL13
TL11.4...TL14
TL11.6...TL15
TL11.8...TL16
TL12......TL17
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  #17  
Old March 19th, 2016, 06:32 PM
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However you make the conversion, GURPS4 TL should be in integer values as skill rolls, purchase prices and so on are based on the TL. Based on that, the option in UltraTech p.7 should come into play. I don't think Eight Drives as being GURPS4 TL12.


Hmm. I feel a unofficial conversion chart coming...
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