Traveller Store CotI Features New Posts Mark Forums Read Register


Go Back TravellerRPG.com > Citizens of the Imperium > Other Versions of Traveller > Mongoose Traveller

Mongoose Traveller Discussion forums for the Traveller rules from Mongoose Publishing.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #241  
Old August 12th, 2007, 08:08 PM
Mytholder Mytholder is offline
Citizen: SOC-8
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Cork
Posts: 40
Gallery : 0
Mytholder Citizen
Default

At a guess - because it creates an extra step in resolution, as opposed to factoring in a constant modifier.
Reply With Quote
  #242  
Old August 12th, 2007, 08:26 PM
hunter hunter is offline
Ancient - Absent Friend
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 6,168
Gallery : 18
Visit hunter's Blog
hunter Citizen
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mytholder View Post
At a guess - because it creates an extra step in resolution, as opposed to factoring in a constant modifier.
Then there's that too
__________________
[b]Current Projects[/b][LIST][*][url=http://www.scifigaming.com]SciFi Gaming[/url][*][url=http://www.rpgnow.com/index.php?cPath=129_7888]The SciFi20 Project[/url][*][url=http://www.rpgnow.com/product_info.php?products_id=96742]The SciFi20 Rules Bundle[/url] [COLOR="red"][SIZE="1"][b]New![/b][/SIZE][/COLOR][*][url=http://www.rpgnow.com/product_info.php?products_id=96744]The SciFi20 Rules Bundle w/Screen[/url] [COLOR="red"][SIZE="1"][b]New![/b][/SIZE][/COLOR]
[/LIST]
Reply With Quote
  #243  
Old August 12th, 2007, 09:20 PM
Echo Echo is offline
Citizen: SOC-12
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 277
Gallery : 0
Echo has disabled reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mytholder View Post
At a guess - because it creates an extra step in resolution, as opposed to factoring in a constant modifier.
Is it a big issue? - I mean, you're creating an extra step in resolution when you are subtracting your stat score from 7, aren't you?

I'd imagine an exchange like this:

Player: I want to change the light bulb.
Referee: That's a 7 target against your Electronics skill and Intelligence.
Player: My Electronics is 3, and my Intelligence is 8, which is more than 7.
Referee: So you have +4 overall. Roll 'em dice!
Player: I roll a 6.....+4, that's a 10. Yippee! I succeed.
Referee: Yes you do, the lightbulb is replaced.
__________________
\"Man can believe the impossible, but man can never believe the improbable.\" Oscar Wilde, The Decay of Living.
Reply With Quote
  #244  
Old August 12th, 2007, 09:24 PM
Echo Echo is offline
Citizen: SOC-12
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 277
Gallery : 0
Echo has disabled reputation
Default

Um...to clarify, I think the skill scores should provide a fixed bonus, but the Characteristic scores a variable bonus (depending upon the difficulty of the task).
__________________
\"Man can believe the impossible, but man can never believe the improbable.\" Oscar Wilde, The Decay of Living.
Reply With Quote
  #245  
Old August 12th, 2007, 09:51 PM
hunter hunter is offline
Ancient - Absent Friend
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 6,168
Gallery : 18
Visit hunter's Blog
hunter Citizen
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Echo View Post
Is it a big issue? - I mean, you're creating an extra step in resolution when you are subtracting your stat score from 7, aren't you?

I'd imagine an exchange like this:

Player: I want to change the light bulb.
Referee: That's a 7 target against your Electronics skill and Intelligence.
Player: My Electronics is 3, and my Intelligence is 8, which is more than 7.
Referee: So you have +4 overall. Roll 'em dice!
Player: I roll a 6.....+4, that's a 10. Yippee! I succeed.
Referee: Yes you do, the lightbulb is replaced.
I'd imagine an exchange like this:

Player: I want to change the light bulb.
Referee: That's a 7 target against your Electronics skill and Intelligence.
Player: My Electronics is 3, and my Intelligence is 15, which is more than 7.
Referee: So you have +4 overall. Roll 'em dice!
Player: So my 15 Intelligence is no better than if I had a 7??

or

Player: I want to change the light bulb.
Referee: That's a 15 target against your Electronics skill and Intelligence.
Player: My Electronics is 3, and my Intelligence is 14, which is less than 14.
Referee: So you have +3 overall. Roll 'em dice!
Player: So I'm only 1 point off the TN and I still get no bonus???
__________________
[b]Current Projects[/b][LIST][*][url=http://www.scifigaming.com]SciFi Gaming[/url][*][url=http://www.rpgnow.com/index.php?cPath=129_7888]The SciFi20 Project[/url][*][url=http://www.rpgnow.com/product_info.php?products_id=96742]The SciFi20 Rules Bundle[/url] [COLOR="red"][SIZE="1"][b]New![/b][/SIZE][/COLOR][*][url=http://www.rpgnow.com/product_info.php?products_id=96744]The SciFi20 Rules Bundle w/Screen[/url] [COLOR="red"][SIZE="1"][b]New![/b][/SIZE][/COLOR]
[/LIST]
Reply With Quote
  #246  
Old August 12th, 2007, 10:16 PM
Tobias Tobias is offline
Citizen: SOC-13
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Braunschweig, Germany
Posts: 795
Gallery : 5
Tobias Citizen
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Echo View Post
The problems I have with doing D&Desque +/- modifiers associated with the Characteristic scores are that they aren't especially intuitive, they require that you need to recorda seperate column of data, and they kinda make the actual Characteristic scores themselves redundant.
That's what I'm getting at when I say you can just as well use a stat range of 1-5.

Quote:
Why don't people like the non-fixed, comparitive bonus criteria I outlined before: where you must compare your characteristic with the difficulty itself to determine if you get a bonus or penalty?
As I wrote elsewhere: It's basically a sound idea, but has a problem when using standard TNs at fixed intervals such as 4,8,12 etc., in which case the stats will again only matter at these intervals as well.
If you don't use fixed intervals but the whole range of 1-15, it's a sound mechanic. I would stick with your original idea of just giving a +1 modifier, though. Makes things easier and doesn't devalue skills.
To make this work, though, the skillset needs to be expanded to include some stuff as "Athletics", "Perception" and such which would normally be handled just by stats.
__________________
"The heart of real science fiction is stories about people and ideas." - Gene Roddenberry

Last edited by Tobias; August 12th, 2007 at 10:34 PM.. Reason: Addition
Reply With Quote
  #247  
Old August 12th, 2007, 10:19 PM
Tobias Tobias is offline
Citizen: SOC-13
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Braunschweig, Germany
Posts: 795
Gallery : 5
Tobias Citizen
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hunter View Post
I'd imagine an exchange like this:

Player: I want to change the light bulb.
Referee: That's a 7 target against your Electronics skill and Intelligence.
Player: My Electronics is 3, and my Intelligence is 15, which is more than 7.
Referee: So you have +4 overall. Roll 'em dice!
Player: So my 15 Intelligence is no better than if I had a 7??
My answer would be: "Yes. For figuring out how to change a lightbulb, even being Albert Einstein is not gonna be of any additional help."
__________________
"The heart of real science fiction is stories about people and ideas." - Gene Roddenberry
Reply With Quote
  #248  
Old August 12th, 2007, 10:38 PM
hunter hunter is offline
Ancient - Absent Friend
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 6,168
Gallery : 18
Visit hunter's Blog
hunter Citizen
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tobias View Post
My answer would be: "Yes. For figuring out how to change a lightbulb, even being Albert Einstein is not gonna be of any additional help."
Somehow I knew this was coming...
__________________
[b]Current Projects[/b][LIST][*][url=http://www.scifigaming.com]SciFi Gaming[/url][*][url=http://www.rpgnow.com/index.php?cPath=129_7888]The SciFi20 Project[/url][*][url=http://www.rpgnow.com/product_info.php?products_id=96742]The SciFi20 Rules Bundle[/url] [COLOR="red"][SIZE="1"][b]New![/b][/SIZE][/COLOR][*][url=http://www.rpgnow.com/product_info.php?products_id=96744]The SciFi20 Rules Bundle w/Screen[/url] [COLOR="red"][SIZE="1"][b]New![/b][/SIZE][/COLOR]
[/LIST]
Reply With Quote
  #249  
Old August 12th, 2007, 11:46 PM
Ptah Ptah is offline
Citizen: SOC-13
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: MA, USA
Posts: 686
Gallery : 0
Ptah Citizen
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by aramis View Post
Moreover, few lawyers are willing to handle cases on subjects that they do not know.

THe few who do know RPG's seem unwilling to go near the OGL... (Specifically Dave Kenzer, for one.)

...
Well that's a new one to me. I think it depends on where you fall in the profession. Top litigators like to pride themselves on handling anything and it's not like there is a dearth of excellent copyright and trademark lawyers out there. The fact it is a copyright or trademark issue in a game context does not make it different. Likewise the OGL, it purports to be a license, it's not like those haven't been seen before. I think most companies are on a shoe string and can't afford $500 an hour for a good attorney, nor do their market revenues make it even worthwhile to care, you'd spend all your profits on legal advice.

Interesting about Kenzer, is he a copyright attorney? If so it would explain alot, Hackmaster always seemed to make every effort to be "parody" laden.

What was the topic? Oh Mongoose Traveller, yah I'll see what it is like. I'm impressed by the stable of licensed names they have. How they got part of Conan I'd like to find out, likewise Starship Troopers.
Reply With Quote
  #250  
Old August 12th, 2007, 11:58 PM
Flynn's Avatar
Flynn Flynn is offline
Citizen: SOC-14
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Austin, TX, USA
Posts: 2,720
Gallery : 0
Visit Flynn's Blog
Flynn Citizen
Send a message via AIM to Flynn
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Takei View Post
I'm curious as to why you suggested 3d6? I think that would result in too much being left to chance when you used a skill as the random roll has a much greater range than character skill or attribute modifier.
Because it is my experience that T4/T5 will have about twice as many skill ranks on the average as a CT/MT character, and 2d6 isn't enough to cover the range, in my opinion. Besides, by tying it to D20's suggested bell curve resolution (and playing on the dice used for both GURPS and HERO), Mongoose can possible attract new gamers.

Remember, in the end, RTT isn't about making you or I happy. We already have our Traveller games, and Mongoose knows that we won't be their target audience. We'll buy supplements and we might buy the core book if we want to support Traveller, but us old Traveller-philes are already hooked.

No, this version of the game is intended to bring in new gamers. Pleasing us is secondary to making a good product that will bring in new gamers. Of course, if we don't work towards supporting that, because it isn't going to be exactly the way we think it should be, all we're doing is shooting the future of Traveller in the foot. New gamers will see us bicker, and get turned off by it, because let's face it, would you game with people that spoke like some of the fans have spoken on the boards? I wouldn't, and I even like some of those guys. Just kiddin', I'd still game with them, but I could understand if new gamers wouldn't want to.

As soon as we realize as the "old guard" of Traveller that we can still enjoy the game we love even with this new edition coming out, and then wait to see what Mongoose produces before we decide how to comment on it, the better this process will go for Traveller as a whole.

Me, I think this whole thing will help Traveller. When the Traveller OGL comes out, we will all have an unprecedented opportunity to help shape Traveller in ways that were never available to us before. That's you and me and the guy that types the next post. We all win.

Sorry, this really wasn't directed at you (well, after the first paragraph, anyway), but rather a disturbing trend I've noticed. So many people appear to be letting their personal feelings about T5, the old playtest material or its creator get in the way of something I think they might really want deep down inside, and that is to bring new gamers into Traveller so that more product will be created to support our favorite game. Maybe I'm wrong, but sometimes, you just got to say something about it, you know.

Hope That Helps,
Flynn
__________________
Jason "Flynn" Kemp
Editor of Stellar Reaches, a free fanzine for Traveller T20 and Classic Traveller
http://stellarreaches.nwgamers.org/
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Cosmos returns! Andrew Boulton The Lone Star 7 September 28th, 2005 04:56 PM

This website and its contents are copyright ©2010- Far Future Enterprises. All rights reserved. Traveller is a registered trademark of Far Future Enterprises .
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright (c) 2010-2013, Far Future Enterprises. All Rights Reserved.