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Old December 17th, 2019, 03:58 AM
Madmax Madmax is offline
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Default Mongoose High Guard (2nd Ed) Question

I'm trying to use MGT High Guard (2nd Ed) for the first time to design a ship.
For learning/testing I am trying to build a tech 12 Scout-Courier, the same as on pg. 110 of High Guard.
I've figured out how to use the rules to make everything in the pg. 110 description except for one thing, the cost of the Armour.
The ship is 100 tons, with 4 points of Crystaliron Armour, which takes up 5 tons.
However when I try to calculate the cost for said armour I come up with MCr 20 as the cost.
Clearly I have misunderstood something, but I don't know what.
I just don't see any way to fiddle the calculation to end up with the MCr 1.2 shown in the example.
Can someone explain how to calculate the cost of ship armour in High Guard?
Thanks
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Old December 17th, 2019, 06:21 AM
Condottiere Condottiere is online now
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Four times one and a quarter percent per armour factor, which gives you five percent of hull volume.

Cost is five percent per armour factor, which gives you twenty percent of hull cost.

Though you should always recalculate all costs (and sometimes volume) of any given ship design, if only for your own peace of mind.
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Old December 17th, 2019, 10:15 AM
AnotherDilbert AnotherDilbert is offline
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Just completing Condottiere's answer with the calculations:

Hull is 100 Dt, configuration Streamlined.
Cost: 100 Dt MCr 0.05 120% = MCr 6

Armour 4 points


Armour tonnage is a percentage of Hull tonnage:
1.25% of the Hull tonnage for each point of armour is:
4 pts 1.25% 100 Dt = 5% 100 Dt = 5 Dt.

Armour cost is a percentage of Hull cost:
5% of Hull cost for each point of armour is:
4 pts 5% MCr 6 [Hull cost] = 20% MCr 6 = MCr 1.2.

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Old December 20th, 2019, 02:21 PM
Madmax Madmax is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnotherDilbert View Post
Just completing Condottiere's answer with the calculations:

...

Armour cost is a percentage of Hull cost:
5% of Hull cost for each point of armour is:
4 pts 5% MCr 6 [Hull cost] = 20% MCr 6 = MCr 1.2.

Thanks very much. As a mathematician I usually understand things much better when I see the equations themselves. Too bad Mongoose doesn't give more examples, it would sure help a lot in understanding the rules.

One question:
I understand that the cost of hull configuration (Streamlined in this case) needs to be included in the calculation, but what about other modifications (such as Heat Shield)? These can increase the Hull cost, but do not increase the surface area of the ship, and therefor I would not expect them to increase the cost of the armour. On the other hand I would think Fins would increase the armour cost. Any rules on what hull additions to include in the calculation and what not to, or is it up to the Referee?
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Old December 20th, 2019, 03:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Madmax View Post
Thanks very much. As a mathematician I usually understand things much better when I see the equations themselves. Too bad Mongoose doesn't give more examples, it would sure help a lot in understanding the rules.

One question:
I understand that the cost of hull configuration (Streamlined in this case) needs to be included in the calculation, but what about other modifications (such as Heat Shield)? These can increase the Hull cost, but do not increase the surface area of the ship, and therefor I would not expect them to increase the cost of the armour. On the other hand I would think Fins would increase the armour cost. Any rules on what hull additions to include in the calculation and what not to, or is it up to the Referee?

I've not seen anything that says what is and isn't counted for the hull costs
off the top of my head, I'd go with these all do NOT increase the hull costs and thus armour costs.

heat shields, for example, are costed per ton of hull, not as an increase in hull cost. same with control fins, their is no reference to hull cost in the description.


as to why, beyond OOC reasons like game balance and such, its easy enough to justify IC as well, as things like manoeuvring fins are going be outside the ships armour and cant be covered in a meter of bonded superdense if they are to function as intended. theirs real-world examples of this (for example, the torpedo hit on the steering gear of the Bismarck, which crippled her despite not penetrating her armour)
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Old December 20th, 2019, 10:58 PM
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Costs are either multiplicators or additions.

In either case, carefully peruse each step of the (space)ship design sequence.
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Old December 21st, 2019, 11:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Madmax View Post
I understand that the cost of hull configuration (Streamlined in this case) needs to be included in the calculation, but what about other modifications (such as Heat Shield)? These can increase the Hull cost, but do not increase the surface area of the ship, and therefor I would not expect them to increase the cost of the armour. On the other hand I would think Fins would increase the armour cost. Any rules on what hull additions to include in the calculation and what not to, or is it up to the Referee?
Hull Options are theoretically separate systems that does not increase the cost of the Hull. Unless it says "increase the cost of the hull ..." it does not affect armour, I believe...


I follow the text.

1. Make a basic hull.
2. Modify hull cost for configuration and Reinforced/Light.
3. Calculate armour.
4. Add Hull options.


I do not count Aerofins when I calculate armour, see Serpent-class Scout p114.
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