Citizens of the Imperium

Citizens of the Imperium (http://www.travellerrpg.com/CotI/Discuss/index.php)
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-   -   How long can you live on anagathics ? (http://www.travellerrpg.com/CotI/Discuss/showthread.php?t=40602)

Tiikeri November 11th, 2019 04:40 PM

Altered Carbon addresses this, as does Eclipse Phase. Once someone can afford immortality, they go on getting richer and more powerful indefinitely. Compound interest for the win. These immortal oligarchs have an immense influence on societies.

So anagathics.

Traveller doesnt explain how they work, only that they do. So arbitrarily pick what fits what you want, and say well it just does.

Rationalizations and narrative justifications.

Something like, wull, anagathics prevent telomere loss, or stimulate mitochondria function, or whatever, but the human body is such a complex system that this has unbalancing side effects to the point where the body cant take it anymore, and people feel tired, go sleep, and pass away for no discernable reason.

Or

200 years of life with toxin buildup, junk food, stress damage, artilage stress, nutrition deficiencies, radiation exposure, statistical cancer risks, diseases, genetic defects expressing themselves, eventually peoples bodies cant take it anymore. Suicide could be another issue, like a noble with dementia wasting away in an asylum, but lingering on for decades.

whartung November 12th, 2019 11:55 AM

If the anagathics are not illegal, but simply expensive, I don't know why those who would use and afford them would not relocate to where they are readily available.

Sure, there could be smuggling of them to interdicted areas, but that continues to suggest that they're available somewhere. They're not (I assume) being cooked up in bathtubs in an RV out in the desert.

mike wightman November 12th, 2019 02:10 PM

What if anagathics are made the way they are in Jupiter Ascending...

wbuthod November 12th, 2019 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mike wightman (Post 608441)
What if anagathics are made the way they are in Jupiter Ascending...

... or as in the Babylon 5 episode, "Deathwalker".

(tangential note: I want to incorporate the Dilgar into an ATU so very much.)

CaptRet November 12th, 2019 07:29 PM

In the Mongoose Traveller, Third Imperium Deneb Sector it notes an Imperial prohibition against nobles using anagathics. It isn't explained, but I'm sure that has to do with the destabilizing effects of such an individual accumulating wealth and power purely via extreme longevity.

timerover51 November 12th, 2019 07:40 PM

I figure that someone using anagathics will live only as long as it takes for an assassin to get to him or her.

GypsyComet November 12th, 2019 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptRet (Post 608450)
In the Mongoose Traveller, Third Imperium Deneb Sector it notes an Imperial prohibition against nobles using anagathics. It isn't explained, but I'm sure that has to do with the destabilizing effects of such an individual accumulating wealth and power purely via extreme longevity.

That isn't the first cite, though I don't recall at the moment where that would be. IIRC it has to do with both a stated desire to keep the titles in motion and with a cautionary event early on in the Third Imperium. Those of Noble family are welcome to partake of anagathics as long as they do not also hold an Imperial Office, thus encouraging those who want to use their power to live forever to hand the reins to the next generation and retire.

Nathan Brazil November 13th, 2019 06:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GypsyComet (Post 608365)
TNE introduces the idea of genetic damage over time, but I could see that as being a side effect of the times. Safe anagathics are a high tech product, and TNE is no longer really high tech.

The implication is that prior editions did not have such worries, so "as long as you can afford it".

Anagathics work differently in TNE as does normal aging. There are interesting side-effects :devil:

1,Aging starts in different terms for different stats. AGL at Term 4, STR, END and INT terms 6, 8, and 12 respectvely. Roll d15 (d20, reroll 16-20s, hey i didnt make the rules!) If you roll higher than your stat, no aging! Equal or under, lose 1 point. Thats it. You can have really old people.

2. All anagathics does is keep you from having to make 2 rolls. Sounds Groovy. Ill just rotate which 2 are immune, each term. This is permitted.

HOWEVER :smirk:
after 15 full terms of use you start roll for side effects which include up to and including psychopathic behavior (NPC land!). Since there are cumulative DMs in this roll, even rolling the minimum every single time you become a psychopath after 92 years (23 terms) of use.

You could try Anagath-B (Bearers of the Flame, p 16) which does not have those side effects, but has a different one. Every time you experience entering jump-space roll a D100. If you roll less than or equal to the years you have taken it, you immediately die.

Hmm. So you can live hard. die young, and leave a beautiful corpse
:coffeesip:

:rofl::rofl::rofl:

CaptRet November 13th, 2019 08:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GypsyComet (Post 608454)
That isn't the first cite, though I don't recall at the moment where that would be. IIRC it has to do with both a stated desire to keep the titles in motion and with a cautionary event early on in the Third Imperium. Those of Noble family are welcome to partake of anagathics as long as they do not also hold an Imperial Office, thus encouraging those who want to use their power to live forever to hand the reins to the next generation and retire.

Thanks GypsyComet - there may be earlier citations (was the first I could find). Actually, reread the citation and it is an "Imperial custom" vice a law. That said, it certainly makes good sense to ensure that the Imperium power structure doesn't ossify (or lead to violent coups).

Thot November 13th, 2019 12:47 PM

What if all the peacefully replaced emperors are still alive, and only decided to abdicate after a certain time, living in cognito on some distant moon?

Nothing speaks against people taking anagathics forever, and hence living forever. Moreover, real-life biology is beginning to reveal that it may actually be relatively easy to rejuvenate people - we proto-Solomani haven't quite figured it out yet, but we seem to be close.

That implies that immortal oligarchs (or in the OTU, nobles) should be expected to run everything, unless firm legal limitations against that are in place. But why would they, when the state is a feudal oligarchy anyway?


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