Citizens of the Imperium

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-   -   Starship Hulls (http://www.travellerrpg.com/CotI/Discuss/showthread.php?t=39080)

coliver988 May 18th, 2018 10:29 AM

Starship Hulls
 
So can a kilometer long starship move without getting ripped apart?

https://medium.com/@brandonweigel/st...e-af55e67f8301

TL;DR - use a different periodic table...

whartung May 18th, 2018 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coliver988 (Post 587074)
So can a kilometer long starship move without getting ripped apart?

https://medium.com/@brandonweigel/st...e-af55e67f8301

TL;DR - use a different periodic table...

Meh, I would have liked to have seen a couple animations of the dynamics involved when you do try to accelerate a kilometer long starship.

Does it just crumple as the impulse from drive tries to overcome the standing momentum of the large hull? Do the drives tear themselves free and fly off on their own? What if they accelerated really really slowly, does that matter?

You'd think somewhere there's a bit of off the shelf engineering software that could pound out a simple analysis like that with a few mouse clicks nowadays.

aramis May 18th, 2018 06:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whartung (Post 587081)
Meh, I would have liked to have seen a couple animations of the dynamics involved when you do try to accelerate a kilometer long starship.

Does it just crumple as the impulse from drive tries to overcome the standing momentum of the large hull? Do the drives tear themselves free and fly off on their own? What if they accelerated really really slowly, does that matter?

You'd think somewhere there's a bit of off the shelf engineering software that could pound out a simple analysis like that with a few mouse clicks nowadays.

All space movement is fundamentally a matter of acceleration. The star destroyers, in order to have the turning radii we see on screen in ROTJ, are doing 2+ G's. Using the canonical masses, sizes, and engine exhaust ports, the drives should shear off their mounts, as the force per unit area is enough to shear our toughest alloys.

In Other Words: that shape and size is impossible to accelerate the way we see on screen.

I have not done the math myself, but have seen several discussions of it over the years.
The more smaller discrete engines, the easier to spread the stresses, provided the individual engines are coordinated to not cause cumulative loads across the thing.... so, to minimize load strains, short, fat pyramids or cones, narrow to aft, with each deck ringed with it's own thrust....

Enoki May 18th, 2018 09:20 PM

Isn't the easy explanation that they get around this because they can manipulate gravity, and that solves the problem...?

BlackBat242 May 18th, 2018 10:35 PM

And use focused-gravity pressors & tractors to keep multiple load centers in the structure in proper relation to each other.

aramis May 19th, 2018 05:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enoki (Post 587088)
Isn't the easy explanation that they get around this because they can manipulate gravity, and that solves the problem...?

Only if using manipulated gravity, rather than the engines for thrust. In which case, those engines shouldn't be there.

Enoki May 19th, 2018 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aramis (Post 587094)
Only if using manipulated gravity, rather than the engines for thrust. In which case, those engines shouldn't be there.

I would think something like the usual "inertial dampeners" of sci-fi would fit the bill. That is, you use your grav system to offset the acceleration of the engines within the ship's structure so it isn't torn apart.

timerover51 May 19th, 2018 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enoki (Post 587097)
I would think something like the usual "inertial dampeners" of sci-fi would fit the bill. That is, you use your grav system to offset the acceleration of the engines within the ship's structure so it isn't torn apart.

The problem with that lies in the turning movements. In order to turn that long of a ship, you will need side thrusters distributed along the hull to assist in turning the ship, with the thrust graduated from the front to the rear. Failing that, any turning maneuver is going to be very gradual.

There are very good reasons why very long merchant ships on water have bow thrusters.

Condottiere May 21st, 2018 04:20 AM

In MongosianSpace, it's a semimegatonne before gravitated hulls are a requirement for structural integrity.

whartung May 21st, 2018 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aramis (Post 587085)
All space movement is fundamentally a matter of acceleration. The star destroyers, in order to have the turning radii we see on screen in ROTJ, are doing 2+ G's. Using the canonical masses, sizes, and engine exhaust ports, the drives should shear off their mounts, as the force per unit area is enough to shear our toughest alloys.

In Other Words: that shape and size is impossible to accelerate the way we see on screen.

Sure, but I'd still like to see an animation of the "Empires designers" as they go through different mechanics and how they fail until the get a design that works.

An Empire Naval Architect Gag Reel, like the early flying machine movies we've all seen.


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